tamuraakemi said:
Where are the breasts in post #8255746?
They are visible in his silhouette through the towel.
Posted under Tags
tamuraakemi said:
Where are the breasts in post #8255746?
They are visible in his silhouette through the towel.
tamuraakemi said:
Where are the breasts in post #8255746?
If you can't see the intentional curvature of the silhouette indicating boobage idk what to tell you man.
Anyways are you continuing to ignore the fact that the line "Current policy is to tag Bridget as male unless physical evidence in the image proves otherwise, including the presence of the transgender flag" doesn't mean only the presence of the trans flag? Breasts are physical evidence.
Ylimegirl said:
If you can't see the intentional curvature of the silhouette indicating boobage idk what to tell you man.
I don't think the tag should be used in cases where you wouldn't tag breasts (or equivalent padding tag, if those are valid) personally, though I recognize the silhouette curvature.
NuclearHellBird said:
Dante is not typically considered a trap, and he also does not have the policy exception that Bridget does, so it's more clear cut for him. As for the applicable policy, this determination was reached a while ago, around the time that this whole issue started in late 2022, though I don't know if it was ever put into a proper rules page, rather than a wiki than anyone can vandalize and then pretend it's gospel.
We have 17 year old art of him with breasts tagged 1girl post #268567 that has never been edit-warred. This is contrary to how we use tags Astolfo gets 1girl-ed when he has breasts as well post #3539262. I feel a mod needs to clarify this and make it formal because these are visually indistinct from genderswap and the artist intent is clear unlike other art in male with breasts.
I feel like I need to add that I already expressed the points raised here in a private message which got completely ignored by this user, by the way.
https://danbooru.donmai.us/dmails/2295987?key=eyJfcmFpbHMiOnsiZGF0YSI6MjI5NTk4NywicHVyIjoiZG1haWxfbGluayJ9fQ--a74ebc416e440e00faf18831c357b374599d0ee18291257e5dd8a5a7adbbda20
NuclearHellBird said:
Current policy is to only mistag Bridget's gender
If it is official policy, then it is not a mistag.
if transgender_flag is present in the post. Bridget is a man, so he'd be tagged 1boy whenever this condition is not met, and in this general case, applicable posts would also be tagged male_with_breasts as a result when he is depicted with breasts.
As was pointed out by others, the transgender flag is just an example and it and other non-bodily evidence is only really considered for SFW posts. It was never meant to exclude the character from being tagged as a girl in legitimate genderswap (mtf) posts.
Sadly, it remains a frequent issue for these posts to be vandalized, Ultexia above being a very recent prime example, who continues to vandalize these tags even though he has already received a negative feedback and gotten banned for it before.
Ultexia was banned for edit-warring, not vandalism. And it's hard to take your second negative feedback for that user seriously when you demonstrated you don't actually understand the policy.
NuclearHellBird said:
Dante is not typically considered a trap, and he also does not have the policy exception that Bridget does, so it's more clear cut for him. As for the applicable policy, this determination was reached a while ago, around the time that this whole issue started in late 2022, though I don't know if it was ever put into a proper rules page, rather than a wiki than anyone can vandalize and then pretend it's gospel.
The policy was introduced in forum #222668, and evazion added the part about the transgender flag himself. The only other change made to that part was a statement blindVigil added clarifying the limitations of non-bodily evidence. Surprisingly, no one seems to have vandalized the wiki since evazion's change (probably because it was locked during the peak of the drama). But even if it was and never fixed, it is not difficult to look through the history and see who added what and when.
I don't think Bridget was made an exception to the rule. Logically, the same rules should apply to any other character. It was most likely explicitly stated in this case because this character is particularly well known and is basically the face of the issue, but there's no reason it shouldn't apply to characters like Oozora Hibari, for example.
Ylimegirl said:
If you can't see the intentional curvature of the silhouette indicating boobage idk what to tell you man.
To be honest, that one seems a bit ambiguous despite the curves when looked at in isolation. They are just slight enough that I could see the argument for them being pecs instead. But the other four should definitely be tagged as 1girl and genderswap (mtf).
Edit: Trying not to make this too much about male with breasts since we already have topic #27603 for that, but I feel this is relevant enough. From said topic (forum #284174):
nonamethanks said:
If it's obvious that it's breasts and it's not just ambiguous clothing folds I'd say just move those posts to 1girl/futanari unless the face is actually masculine. It's ridiculous that something like post #7345723 or post #6708223 is currently under 1boy.
Updated by Blank User
Since the mods seem to be siding with NHB on this, can they come forward and explain how the aforementioned contested Bridget posts with obvious female features are not 1girl genderswap (mtf)?
nyom said:
Since the mods seem to be siding with NHB on this, can they come forward and explain how the aforementioned contested Bridget posts with obvious female features are not 1girl genderswap (mtf)?
+1. While user #900083 is probably a bit over-eager in reverting, NHB is edit warring posts that quite clearly seem to fit into the "physical evidence" part of the wiki, so both users are making similar amounts of bad edits:
post #8770872 has me particularly stumped as to how it's being edit warred to begin with. where exactly is the bulge supposed to be?
Where is the indication that Bridget is a boy here?
nyom said:
Since the mods seem to be siding with NHB on this
No, I'm with the side of "stop fucking giving each other feedbacks like you're schoolgirls catfighting and stop jumping the gun the moment someone disagrees with you". I'm exhausted from the bridget discourse but I took a glance at this discussion and post #8255746 to me just looks like an outline of testicles.
And this looks like the hint of a bulge to me, I see a line going straight up:
asset #26983918
nonamethanks said:
No, I'm with the side of "stop fucking giving each other feedbacks like you're schoolgirls catfighting and stop jumping the gun the moment someone disagrees with you". I'm exhausted from the bridget discourse but I took a glance at this discussion and post #8255746 to me just looks like an outline of testicles.
And this looks like the hint of a bulge to me, I see a line going straight up:
asset #26983918
This is a sentiment I could wholeheartedly get behind, if not for the fact that Ultexia's negative feedbacks are still intact even though most of what they did was correct mistags from another user.
That's just misrepresenting my feedback. Preceeding it was a rather long discourse regarding NHB's tagging (including in this very thread, as pointed out in forum #364432). The feedback was separate from the Bridget discourse, it was because NHB was handing out feedbacks to others (deleted now, good) over it while himself constantly making edits with about the same degree of accuracy, while consistently misrepresenting what little established policy there is. I didn't exactly give it on a whim, but rather after a rather long pattern of shitty behavior.
Also, post #8770872 is just how this artist draws bikinis (see post #8356949, slightly different style and different kind of bikini, but a similar slight bulge). It feels like the clause in the wiki might as well be removed because "physical evidence" is ignored in favor of "potential could-be evidence of the contrary" every single time. post #8751464 has breasts and an overall feminine look, but there could be a penis there! Not to mention when combined with male with breasts (topic #27603).
nonamethanks said:
No, I'm with the side of "stop fucking giving each other feedbacks like you're schoolgirls catfighting and stop jumping the gun the moment someone disagrees with you". I'm exhausted from the bridget discourse but I took a glance at this discussion and post #8255746 to me just looks like an outline of testicles.
And this looks like the hint of a bulge to me, I see a line going straight up:
asset #26983918
I think those details are also a bit ambiguous (post #8255746 looks like the curvature of the butt to me), but it doesn't really matter. The burden of proof should be on the ones claiming the posts depict a girl as Bridget is considered a boy by default. If these two posts were depicting someone canonically more sexually ambiguous like Frisk, I would consider tagging 1other like you normally would for that character.
I said those other four posts should be tagged with 1girl genderswap (mtf) because it very clearly shows her with breasts. But some of the others being argued about seem like you need to look very closely to tell if she's a girl or not. If we need to break out the magnifying glasses to argue about small details that might indicate a female body but could just as easily fall under what's typical for how feminine boys are depicted (within reason), then I would not consider that strong enough evidence to justify changing the tags from the default.
Edit: Actually, for post #8770782, I think the chest makes this look more like a girl, and I'm satisfied with the explanation of the bulge ANON TOKYO gave, which supports my opinion about the bulge being ambiguous. Still on the fence on post #8255746, though.
Updated by Blank User
My final opinion is that images like post #8168046 were being vandalized as 1boy when I don't care how you slice it that's a genderswap. The ones above have more nuance, and I still think all of them including the towel one are intended as 1girl, but regardless as long as we agree when breasts are present (not puffy chest) trap doesn't apply then we are good.
reg_panda said:
BUR #42868 has been rejected.
create alias trap -> otokonoko
The BUR #40541 about alias otoko_no_ko -> trap was downvoted 103:69, and should've not been accepted as it was.
I suspect otokonoko has a majority support over trap, either way, this BUR can function as a proof of support for trap in case it has it.
reg_panda said:
BUR #42868 has been rejected.
create alias trap -> otokonoko
The BUR #40541 about alias otoko_no_ko -> trap was downvoted 103:69, and should've not been accepted as it was.
I suspect otokonoko has a majority support over trap, either way, this BUR can function as a proof of support for trap in case it has it.
Wth is this??? Trap has only been around for the last couple of years while Otoko_no_ko has been there for like 20+. Plus a trap is a character you didn't know was a male, which does is not necessarily linked to most otokonokos
My biggest problem with using trap as the tag is that I really feel like artists and tropes have moved passed it and its implications. While many characters can be described as a trap, nobody really draws with that intention anymore. Most drawings of Astolfo are loud and proud about the dick yet can still pretty easily fall under the tag; post #3834354 and its child come to mind here. Characters like Osana_najimi_(komi-san_wa_komyushou_desu) just shrug it off and have fun with it, it's more of a thing they're proud of then embarrassed about. Characters like arikawa_hime or OG bridget_(guilty_gear) are becoming less common then Astolfo (the literal femboy posterchild) or venti_(genshin_impact). kanzaki_hideri is a pretty good display of that transition.
I honestly don't see any reason why we cant have the trap tag AND otokonoko/femboy. We might as well already, considering the girly_boy tag name is literally just a synonym for femboy. There's also 8 pages of post tagged with both despite girly_boys wiki saying they shouldn't be confused.