A Consistent Standard For Separating Disney Adaptation Copyrights from their Original Copyrights

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Damian0358

BUR #41027 has been rejected.

rename peter_pan_(character) -> peter_pan_(j._m._barrie)
rename peter_pan -> peter_pan_(novel)

Damian0358 said:

Following up the Peter Pan BUR, separating out the chartag.

On Discord, NNT questioned the BUR by pointing out the complicated nature of the tags were this to pass: Walt Disney's Peter Pan and Peter Pan (Disney) on the one hand, and Peter Pan and Peter Pan (character) on the other. With the separation of the chartags, I already considered the need for the disambiguation of the non-Disney tags, but I've been conflicted over how to disambiguate them.

The main issue when it comes to Peter Pan is the fact that he doesn't have one central original work. He debuted in The Little White Bird in 1902 (with those specific chapters eventually being released separately as Peter Pan in Kensington Gardens in 1906), before receiving his own play in 1904 entitled Peter Pan; or, the Boy Who Wouldn't Grow Up (which later got a novel release in 1912 as Peter and Wendy). As a result, it all gets simplified down to Peter Pan. Unlike Andersen's Little Mermaid, who we found a workaround for with Andersen's Fairy Tales, Peter having more than one work makes doing something similar difficult. What I've considered for his chartag, Peter Pan (J. M. Barrie), would have to work as his copytag instead, unless we a) want to add a (novel) qualifier for the copytag; or b) use the play name as the copytag.

So I'll propose all three options. The first is (novel) copytag.

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World Funeral Confetto
nonamethanks

Damian0358 said:

BUR #40635 has been rejected.

create alias little_red_riding_hood -> little_red_riding_hood_(fairy_tale)
remove alias little_red_riding_hood -> little_red_riding_hood_(fairy_tale)
category little_red_riding_hood -> character
create alias little_red_riding_hood_(grimm) -> little_red_riding_hood

Generalizing fairy tale versions to Grimm though isn't unique to these stories though. Little Red Riding Hood (Grimm) is Red's chartag, but we have tons of older pre-Grimm tellings of the story, so following up on forum #137759, if we don't want to do Grimm generalizations, we got to deal with that chartag. The (fairy_tale) isn't too common, but it does exist, giving us the perfect venue for the copytag. This and the Sleeping Beauty BUR being approved gives us the option to use that qualifier for copytag separation purposes.

This is just moving the ambiguity to the chartag. These tags have been plagued with mistags for more than a decade, I don't think this is the play here. They should all get some sort of qualifier or they'll just keep getting slapped on random copyrights or used as the opposite copytag/chartag.

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nonamethanks

Damian0358 said:

BUR #41027 has been rejected.

rename peter_pan_(character) -> peter_pan_(j._m._barrie)
rename peter_pan -> peter_pan_(novel)

On Discord, NNT questioned the BUR by pointing out the complicated nature of the tags were this to pass: Walt Disney's Peter Pan and Peter Pan (Disney) on the one hand, and Peter Pan and Peter Pan (character) on the other. With the separation of the chartags, I already considered the need for the disambiguation of the non-Disney tags, but I've been conflicted over how to disambiguate them.

The main issue when it comes to Peter Pan is the fact that he doesn't have one central original work. He debuted in The Little White Bird in 1902 (with those specific chapters eventually being released separately as Peter Pan in Kensington Gardens in 1906), before receiving his own play in 1904 entitled Peter Pan; or, the Boy Who Wouldn't Grow Up (which later got a novel release in 1912 as Peter and Wendy). As a result, it all gets simplified down to Peter Pan. Unlike Andersen's Little Mermaid, who we found a workaround for with Andersen's Fairy Tales, Peter having more than one work makes doing something similar difficult. What I've considered for his chartag, Peter Pan (J. M. Barrie), would have to work as his copytag instead, unless we a) want to add a (novel) qualifier for the copytag; or b) use the play name as the copytag.

So I'll propose all three options. The first is (novel) copytag.

Using the artist name for the chartag doesn't make much sense here. My first idea was something like peter pan (original character) but original has a different meaning on danbooru. Maybe peter pan (novel character)?

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Damian0358

BUR #41241 has been approved by @nonamethanks.

rename peter_pan -> peter_pan_(novel)
rename peter_pan_(character) -> peter_pan_(novel_character)

nonamethanks said:

Using the artist name for the chartag doesn't make much sense here. My first idea was something like peter pan (original character) but original has a different meaning on danbooru. Maybe peter pan (novel character)?

Here's the fourth option, your suggestion of utilizing the (*_character) approach for the chartag. And remember, approve the chartag separation BUR first.

Updated by Damian0358

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zetsubousensei
Damian0358

BUR #41242 has been approved by @nonamethanks.

create alias little_red_riding_hood -> little_red_riding_hood_(fairy_tale)
remove alias little_red_riding_hood -> little_red_riding_hood_(fairy_tale)
create alias little_red_riding_hood_(grimm) -> little_red_riding_hood_(fairy_tale_character)

nonamethanks said:

This is just moving the ambiguity to the chartag. These tags have been plagued with mistags for more than a decade, I don't think this is the play here. They should all get some sort of qualifier or they'll just keep getting slapped on random copyrights or used as the opposite copytag/chartag.

Linking up with your Peter Pan suggestion, how about this?

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Damian0358

Looking at the remaining tags that'd need potential separation:

  • 101 Dalmatians is entirely represented by Disney, so unless we want to preemptively qualify it, it should be fine;
  • Alice in Wonderland would require someone to prep either non-Disney Alice or Disney Alice before any BUR can be done, so get the folks working on Alice Allusion in topic #31222 to deal with that;
  • Beauty and the Beast would have to be checked whether or not it solely depicts the Disney version;
  • The Black Cauldron is an adaptation but it has so few posts one has to wonder whether it's worth bothering;
  • We need to figure out a way to separate Cinderella still;
  • The Hunchback of Notre Dame was what made @tapnek make this thread to begin with - with the above Peter Pan proposal, you could use (novel) as the qualifier for the non-Disney versions of the copytag and chartags that need them like Quasimodo and Frollo;
  • The Jungle Book is an 'adaptation' too but like, it's 100% Disney, I can't imagine it has non-Disney art
  • Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs still needs a solution disambiguating Queen (Snow White) from her Disney counterpart, Queen Grimhilde;

Updated by Damian0358

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Damian0358

BUR #41257 has been approved by @nonamethanks.

rename rapunzel -> rapunzel_(fairy_tale)
create alias rapunzel_(grimm) -> rapunzel_(fairy_tale_character)

Tangled is disambiguated as a copytag, but Rapunzel isn't, which causes some people to mistag it as Rapunzel (Disney)'s copytag. Following what we've done so far to disambiguate fairy tale copytags, along with the proposed (fairy_tale_character) qualifier for the character.

Updated by Damian0358

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Damian0358

BUR #41260 has been approved by @nonamethanks.

mass update pinocchio_(character) pinocchio -> char:pinocchio_(the_adventures_of_pinocchio) -pinocchio_(character)
mass update pinocchio_(character) pinocchio_(character)_(cosplay) pinocchio -> pinocchio_(the_adventures_of_pinocchio) pinocchio_(the_adventures_of_pinocchio)_(cosplay) -pinocchio_(character) -pinocchio_(character)_(cosplay)
mass update pinocchio -> copy:the_adventures_of_pinocchio -pinocchio
rename geppetto -> geppetto_(the_adventures_of_pinocchio)
rename pinocchio_(character) -> pinocchio_(disney_character)
rename pinocchio_(disney) -> pinocchio_(disney_movie)

Pinocchio (Disney) needs to be given the Peter Pan chartag separation treatment, because we only have Pinocchio (character) as a chartag. Checking the Pinocchio tags, it seems the tags are actually cleanly divided beyond the chartag, so doing this should be fine. We can use what we did for Robin Hood for qualifiers for the Disney version.

The reason why I'm mass-updating the non-Disney copytag is because Pinocchio's wiki is clearly meant to be a chartag wiki, so when this BUR goes through, its wiki can be manually moved to Pinocchio (The Adventures of Pinocchio).

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