alias symbol-only_commentary -> untranslatable_commentary

The bulk update request #54218 (forum #416221) has been rejected by @nonamethanks.

Still think the new tag name isn't very sensical, but whatever.

Also BUR machine broke.

DanbooruBot said in forum #417443:

The bulk update request #54216 (forum #416211) has been approved by @nonamethanks.

Now topic #32745 has been solved.
And symbol commentaries are not all untranslatable. Example: post #10584163

大專肄業廢物孔選仲 said in forum #417968:

Now topic #32745 has been solved.
And symbol-only commentaries are not all untranslatable. Example: post #10584163

I wouldn't count that as something that needs to get "translated", more of a joke that is best explained with a note. Replacing the symbol completely changes the commentary.

This bulk update request is pending automatic rejection in 5 days.

BUR #55972 has been approved by @nonamethanks.

deprecate hashtag-only_commentary

This tag was a mistake for the reasons mentioned in the thread. Let's shelve it now that we have untranslatable commentary. We can figure out how to properly sort the posts into the appropriate tags as long as people don't keep adding it to new posts.

The bulk update request #55972 (forum #422658) has been approved by @nonamethanks.

The bulk update request #54220 (forum #416225) has been rejected by @nonamethanks.

I'm fairly sure this is just going to drag on forever until there's some sort of rules people can follow to determine whether something is worth translating, and until there's some non-clunky formal way to translate hashtags (using either new or existing methods).

Well, might as well use this time to slap in this search for hashtag-only commentary that can probably safely be replaced with just the commentary tag. Not touching on how to handle non-alphanumeric hashtags.

same query but only posts with the commentary tag / same query but only posts WITHOUT the commentary tag

i will miss u 2, hashtag-only commentary and emoji commentary

rarely it happened, but a couple of times these tags helped me find specific posts i remembered but could not conveniently find otherwise, but helped by a commentary that stood out to me 'as much' as the image,
think a commentary like 🇭🇰🥇 or
or #Suzuran #Is #Number1

Now that hashtag-only commentary has been deprecated, is there a how to for translating hashtags? Referring to post #11019904, the last hashtag is "ゼンゼロ" which translates to Zenless Zone Zero. Should I leave it alone and tag it commentary, or translate it? If I translate it, is there any difference in formatting I should do? I tried searching the wiki first, but I didn't find anything.

Placeholder1996 said in forum #424650:

Now that hashtag-only commentary has been deprecated, is there a how to for translating hashtags? Referring to post #11019904, the last hashtag is "ゼンゼロ" which translates to Zenless Zone Zero. Should I leave it alone and tag it commentary, or translate it? If I translate it, is there any difference in formatting I should do? I tried searching the wiki first, but I didn't find anything.

This has never been resolved! Previously: topic #30029, topic #31197, forum #416257 for my thoughts specifically

i am so tired of all this i have flip-flopped between translating hashtags and not translating hashtags. i am ignoring the non-alphanumeric hashtag-only commentary posts. nobody can agree on shit

With hashtags, you expect that #ZenlessZoneZero and #ゼンゼロ will lead to respective hashtag search pages, #ZenlessZoneZero breaks this expectation.
For that reason, I am against inline translation, which also in cases like "#ZenlessZoneZero #ZenlessZoneZero #ZenlessZoneZero" looks quite silly and confusing.

In cases of "duplicate" hashtags like that (eg post #10862354), couldn't you just leave it alone, tagged as bilingual commentary, commentary, english commentary, and whatever other language tags that apply?

I think a more annoying problem for me is figuring out the correct "translations" of hashtags. Like as someone who knows very little about the game, it's not immediately obvious to me that "#ゼンゼロ" should be translated to specifically "#ZenlessZoneZero", as opposed to #ZZZero, #ZZZ, or #ZenZero.

hdk5 said in forum #424668:

With hashtags, you expect that #ZenlessZoneZero and #ゼンゼロ will lead to respective hashtag search pages, #ZenlessZoneZero breaks this expectation.
For that reason, I am against inline translation, which also in cases like "#ZenlessZoneZero #ZenlessZoneZero #ZenlessZoneZero" looks quite silly and confusing.

For this reason I am heavily against translating hashtags in-line too. If a hashtag is worth translating, doing it through a [tn] is fine albeit a bit ugly.

I'm bewildered by some of the tagging being done by the @CommentaryRequest bot in response to this.

Why is post #9882799 commentary request but post #9817200 untranslatable commentary?
Why is post #10098252 commentary request but post #9908410 untranslatable commentary?
Why is post #9456078 commentary request but post #9616188 untranslatable commentary?
Why is post #8494674 commentary request but post #8458419 untranslatable commentary?

Doesn't make any sense to me.

Personally, what I would have tagged as hashtag-only commentary before, I now just tag as commentary and nothing else. "超かぐや姫!" isn't literally untranslatable, so untranslatable commentary is wrong. But it isn't commentary request either in my view, since I very much agree that hashtags generally shouldn't be translated. Especially when they're just copyright hashtags.

hdk5 said in forum #424668:

For that reason, I am against inline translation, which also in cases like "#ZenlessZoneZero #ZenlessZoneZero #ZenlessZoneZero" looks quite silly and confusing.

For cases where the hashtag is repeated in different languages, I currently qualify the non-English hashtags.

For the above case, it'd be:

#ZenlessZoneZero(cn) #ZenlessZoneZero(jp) #ZenlessZoneZero

The TN version would be:

#绝区零 (ZenlessZoneZero) #ゼンゼロ (ZenlessZoneZero)#ZenlessZoneZero

If DText is expanded to include Ruby tags, then that could also be an option, i.e. the TN text would appear above instead of beside.

A fourth option could be extending DText so that the title attribute on links could be specified, i.e. the text would popup when the link is hovered over.

Not sure which option is the most preferable, but regardless of what form it takes, I'm for translating hashtags and not leaving them untranslated. Because as has already been pointed out, most of the userbase is English-speaking and won't understand what the untranslated hashtags say.

Qualifying the hashtag seems even worse because then it's both textually and conceptually different.

I would like a way for TPT-style annotations for this though.

CoreMack said in forum #424721:

I set it up to tag hashtags that only have character and copyright names (which included some ship names) as untranslatable commentary, and everything else that isn't in English as commentary request.

However, I made the mistake of doing this before there was any clear consensus or statement from the admins on what should and should not be tagged as untranslatable. I have stopped doing anything with the hashtag-only commentary tag until there is any clear rule on how to handle it. Though once there is, it shouldn't be too hard to undo wrong edits, if any, as I've kept records of the edits that were done.

Sorry for all the confusion this caused.