So this type of incomplete project could have rivaled the Yamato-class tho just in size and not firepower. She being an ice mage is weird and completely random to me.
Ngl is weird for Manjuu to not base the character design from heir namesake, i was expecting a hammer and sickle, i mean even KanColle doesnt shy from that(Example:Tahskent), but the NP's motifs are not helping her stand out with all that white and nothing but white, they really are "IB but white", and offcourse the exposed cleavage is a must.
No really. But if you think about it Deutschland's name also doesn't make sense since there is not a proper Germany in game either
Iron Blood is basically "We're totally not Germany wink wink" while the Northern Parliament is more along the lines of "We're totally not the Russian Empire/Republic/Federation wink wink" which could make Sovetsky Soyuz's name a lore break. Not to mention that you either need to be a really dedicated fan of WWII naval history or a World of Warships player to even know about her which can not be said of Deutschland. That means that changing her name to "Sovetskaya Respublika" would be an interesting detail in a similar way to how Unzen is not named "Zao" in Azur Lane while changing Deutschland's name to "Eisenblut" would just be confusing.
Iron Blood is basically "We're totally not Germany wink wink" while the Northern Parliament is more along the lines of "We're totally not the Russian Empire/Republic/Federation wink wink" which could make Sovetsky Soyuz's name a lore break. Not to mention that you either need to be a really dedicated fan of WWII naval history or a World of Warships player to even know about her which can not be said of Deutschland. That means that changing her name to "Sovetskaya Respublika" would be an interesting detail in a similar way to how Unzen is not named "Zao" in Azur Lane while changing Deutschland's name to "Eisenblut" would just be confusing.
Why would they change the name of a real life ship to fit it into lore if the game runs off of real ships by default? It'd make no sense to rename Sovetsky Soyuz as that was the only name given to her. Unzen is a different name to Zao because there was no defined name to the project she's based on, even Wargaming went through a series of names when adding Zao to WoWs. Changing a real project's name for lore would be pointless. You could name Deutschland to her other real life name, Lützow, but then it'd conflict with SMS Lützow. Just keep the name to Sovetsky Soyuz, it's the name everyone who knows the ship by... changing it would just be a hassle for no reason, even with lore arguments.
Why would they change the name of a real life ship to fit it into lore if the game runs off of real ships by default? It'd make no sense to rename Sovetsky Soyuz as that was the only name given to her. Unzen is a different name to Zao because there was no defined name to the project she's based on, even Wargaming went through a series of names when adding Zao to WoWs. Changing a real project's name for lore would be pointless. You could name Deutschland to her other real life name, Lützow, but then it'd conflict with SMS Lützow. Just keep the name to Sovetsky Soyuz, it's the name everyone who knows the ship by... changing it would just be a hassle for no reason, even with lore arguments.
So how would you include the Wickes-class destroyer Ingraham? Should we change the current one's name to "Miaoulis"? For that matter, is Azur Lane supposed to be historical or not? When creating a franchise about exploring history, you can't just pick and choose which parts of history to follow with no rhyme or reason to them. Otherwise, you might as well just make one about trying to save some major university or working in a post-apocalyptic hospital with a bunch of human-animal hybrids. You can't really have it both ways there has to be some consistency.
There are rarities, like the Chinese Leningrads and inter-war or WWI ships, however the main basis is WWII or in an era dominated by gun-heavy ships. I can only assume Yostar added the specified Chinese-purchased Leningrads to give the Chinese a ship to have for some sort of fictional representation of the PLAN, and that's likely why they divided France up into two factions too, to fit with a close, but not 100% connection to WWII by having two factions represent Free France and Vichy France, under the combined faction you can label 'France'. Maybe I'm wrong, but it doesn't feel like it's a specified era, just a representation of nations through a certain period of time, using as many ships from reality as possible and giving educated names to projects without names, like the recent ROC rearmament ships from the 2024 New Years or Unzen.
Why would Yongshi include a naval power that didn't exist until 1949 if they're just focusing on WWII and WWI? I also must congratulate you for bringing up France since the way it's handled is another major pet peeve given how the ideological differences between Vichy France and Free France were borderline nonexistent. Especially compared to the ideological differences between the Republic of China and the People's Republic of China. The civil war within the Iris Orthodoxy is a massive insult to history when you consider that the Dragon Empery has no such thing. For that matter, where are the references to Benson's Chinese service? What about Bristol's anti-ship missiles that were fitted to her as a reaction to the Anshan-class getting anti-ship missiles? Could all of this have something to do with the CCP commissars that Yongshi is required by law to hire?
Valyan_THEA said: Azur Lane is based on WWII context.
From what i saw back then the main basis was always a sci-fi with T&A , idols and a very surface naval motif. Most events arent even about ww2, most shipgirls now have zero relations with their irl counterparts by their designs(lil ship variants for lolicons and muses for people that are into idols) and on top of that they have events that have zero relationship with ww2. Shipgirl like Hood arent going to be a thing in the future.
We are not in 2017 anymore sadly and even back then we had ships like Benson that had bunny ears because why not?
Probably the thing that mades me grind my teeth is how Manjuu has forgotten 90% of the roster, and instead working on previous shipgirls so they can have some stories so we can know them and get invested in them(like the way BA handle their characters) but instead we get spammed with non URs that people dont care by the next event that end up in the same situation as the 90%.
Well at least there is Victory Belles and KanColle for a more history based alternative with a more general less coomerbait designs, yeah people who bitch about Amatsukaze Kai Ni not having a fully transparent uniform and not showing her bare ass in her damaged CG can honestly go to AL for what i care since both games went to completely opposite artistic directions.
To me, they should add more balance towards certain parts of history, retrofits to WWII ships for the Cold War (but definitely not BBs, a retrofit New Jersey is for sure not going to be helpful to anything gameplay-wise...) without it being biased like we see with the Dragon Empery and their PLAN DDGs, but I suppose they never will due to balance reasons and interests in keeping certain gimmicks to certain nations. Would also like to say I'm sorry for incorrectly labelling said PLAN DDGs.
From what i saw back then the main basis was always a sci-fi with T&A , idols and a very surface naval motif. Most events arent even about ww2, most shipgirls now have zero relations with their irl counterparts by their designs(lil ship variants for lolicons and muses for people that are into idols) and on top of that they have events that have zero relationship with ww2. Shipgirl like Hood arent going to be a thing in the future.
We are not in 2017 anymore sadly and even back then we had ships like Benson that had bunny ears because why not?
Probably the thing that mades me grind my teeth is how Manjuu has forgotten 90% of the roster, and instead working on previous shipgirls so they can have some stories so we can know them and get invested in them(like the way BA handle their characters) but instead we get spammed with non URs that people dont care by the next event that end up in the same situation as the 90%.
Well at least there is Victory Belles and KanColle for a more history based alternative with a more general less coomerbait designs, yeah people who bitch about Amatsukaze Kai Ni not having a fully transparent uniform and not showing her bare ass in her damaged CG can honestly go to AL for what i care since both games went to completely opposite artistic directions.
To be honest, I basically disagree with you. AL has to come up with its own story based on WW2, and many people don't want its story to be just a vassal of WW2's history, even if it's not friendly to avid fans who like to recreate history. In addition, many non-UR characters do have a lot of stories of their own - such as personal episodes and appearances in subsequent events, and there are many people who are caring about them. However, it is also true that there are some characters who do not have more stories. Also, at least I think the BA's approach to their characters - the action of creating stories for previous characters - is good, but they are still very superficial and mediocre in their narration and depiction (and even less readable than ordinary novels), not unlike AL that you don't really like.
I feel like the KAN-SEN's dialogue and personality should hint-- even slightly-- at the ship she's named after, because why even model them after real-life-- or almost-real-life-- ships in the first place? You might as well make up a new character.
On the other hand, the story started out as a fairly accurate "reenactment"-- the term used in-game-- of WWII, but as time went on, the characters realized they were being manipulated by an outside force. It makes perfect sense that the story should go off the rails and into their own thing from there. The Fool's Scales reveals that even events not based on RL history are considered "reenactments" by the Sirens, emphasizing the fact they can travel into different dimensions/timelines, and just how powerful they are.
And no, I don't think having a different design philosophy from KanColle or Victory Belles is part of the problem. AL has been shamelessly lewd and over-the-top since day one. You can have a great series with lots of fanservice and bombastic designs.
There's a happy medium between all of that, and in my opinion, Azur Lane achieved that for their first few years; if it didn't, I wouldn't be here writing a long essay describing how I felt about it. I think a bigger problem is not that the game has become less historically-accurate or more concentrated on fanservice, but that the overarching plot doesn't have the emotional impact that it used to, and I'd imagine the problems are related somehow. But that's another story for another day.
I feel like the KAN-SEN's dialogue and personality should hint-- even slightly-- at the ship she's named after, because why even model them after real-life-- or almost-real-life-- ships in the first place? You might as well make up a new character.
On the other hand, the story started out as a fairly accurate "reenactment"-- the term used in-game-- of WWII, but as time went on, the characters realized they were being manipulated by an outside force. It makes perfect sense that the story should go off the rails and into their own thing from there. The Fool's Scales reveals that even events not based on RL history are considered "reenactments" by the Sirens, emphasizing the fact they can travel into different dimensions/timelines, and just how powerful they are.
And no, I don't think having a different design philosophy from KanColle or Victory Belles is part of the problem. AL has been shamelessly lewd and over-the-top since day one. You can have a great series with lots of fanservice and bombastic designs.
There's a happy medium between all of that, and in my opinion, Azur Lane achieved that for their first few years; if it didn't, I wouldn't be here writing a long essay describing how I felt about it. I think a bigger problem is not that the game has become less historically-accurate or more concentrated on fanservice, but that the overarching plot doesn't have the emotional impact that it used to, and I'd imagine the problems are related somehow. But that's another story for another day.
Well. I use what I have seen and thought to make my point: First, the idea of make up a new character doesn't seem to work in a KAN-SEN game. Not only was it a matter of laborious rebuilding the game world, but more importantly, a rich historical that could be used to build the game world was abandoned. Second, while many of AL's designs are indeed eroticly exaggerated, but the idea can be traced back to the huge number of adult doujinshi drawn by Japanese fans for their characters many years ago when KanColle became popular (not KanColle itself design). As an AL player, I don't think there's any "original sin" in AL's overly pornographic designs. Like you said, different design ideas aren't a problem. Thirdly, about the overall plot. I feel that many people have diametrically opposite attitudes towards "restoring history" and "moving plots". History requires us to take the time to learn and understand, and such barriers are not of interest to the average player. I learned from my friends in China (who also play AL) that there is also some dissatisfaction in the discussion among Chinese AL players, because some of the girls' artillery and so on have not been restored to history. But more voices tend not to care, or think that the former are narcissists who only show off their knowledge of warships and overly value their own requirements (I prefer the latter). However, in terms of plot, they are very unified, and they basically think that it is not good enough. Honestly, this is a problem that almost all games with a lot of plot - the impact of the popularity of the Internet means that text story work is no longer the preserve of professional writers, and many people who have no professional skills and are just ordinary are hired to write the game's plot, resulting in (at least partially) player dissatisfaction with the story. This happens not only with AL, but also with BA and various games that have become popular in recent years. This is my understanding and opinion. What are your insights? Friendly discussions and exchanges are welcome.
100% history accuracy isn’t a necessity since kancolle already had that down. We should enjoy this game as it does its own twists and designs on the ships rather than wish for it to be a kancolle carbon copy. If the missed historical accuracy in AL ships really bothers you then just go play kancolle👍🏻
I agree that it doesn't make sense to create a character out of whole cloth in a series like this. I feel like the best way to do this in AL is to take a character with nothing interesting in their service history, or, to take a design that was theorized but never actually existed, like most of the PR ships. What I meant by "make up a new character" was designing a different character in a new series, like Aether Gazer, also made by Manjuu.
Azur Lane doesn't need to be 100% historically accurate or even 50% historically accurate; for me, all you need to make a good nod is one or two lines, like Alabama's "stranger" line where she talks about wanting to fight with Tirpitz (a reference to Operation Governor), but nowadays, it feels like most ships don't even get that.
Like I said, the problem is not the fanservice, or the lack of historical accuracy; it feels more like these are just symptoms of Azur Lane's overall decline in quality, which includes a slow and plodding plot, and the sprites having excessive background details which are either ignored, or distract from the character itself. You said part of the problem might be hiring more outside writers from the Internet, and that makes sense. These writers are probably very familiar with Azur Lane, but mostly through the lewd fanart, which results in them writing the series as if fanservice is all it's about.
To me, what Black & White was to Pokémon, Rondo at Rainbow's End was to Azur Lane. What should've been the start of a new direction for the franchise (in AL's case, adding ships from the first World War and uniting the factions together against the Sirens), was just the last hurrah before the downfall.
Anyway, if you made it this far, thank you for reading. Sorry for the constant edits.
I agree that it doesn't make sense to create a character out of whole cloth in a series like this. I feel like the best way to do this in AL is to take a character with nothing interesting in their service history, or, to take a design that was theorized but never actually existed, like most of the PR ships. What I meant by "make up a new character" was designing a different character in a new series, like Aether Gazer, also made by Manjuu.
Azur Lane doesn't need to be 100% historically accurate or even 50% historically accurate; for me, all you need to make a good nod is one or two lines, like Alabama's "stranger" line where she talks about wanting to fight with Tirpitz (a reference to Operation Governor), but nowadays, it feels like most ships don't even get that.
Like I said, the problem is not the fanservice, or the lack of historical accuracy; it feels more like these are just symptoms of Azur Lane's overall decline in quality, which includes a slow and plodding plot, and the sprites having excessive background details which are either ignored, or distract from the character itself. You said part of the problem might be hiring more outside writers from the Internet, and that makes sense. These writers are probably very familiar with Azur Lane, but mostly through the lewd fanart, which results in them writing the series as if fanservice is all it's about.
To me, what Black & White was to Pokémon, Rondo at Rainbow's End was to Azur Lane. What should've been the start of a new direction for the franchise (in AL's case, adding ships from the first World War and uniting the factions together against the Sirens), was just the last hurrah before the downfall.
Anyway, if you made it this far, thank you for reading. Sorry for the constant edits.
Thank you for your kind answer, but allow me to add to what I said earlier. From my point of view, I think the plots of AL, BA and others have a significant flaw in common: the protagonist is too omnipotence in the story, which makes the story thin. I agree that the main characters of the story need some special extra abilities, but these protagonists are invincible with their superpowers (such as the nature of the commander and the cards of Sensei) in the events of each event. If this has always been the case, how are these stories different from our sometimes daydreaming conjectures and childish fairy tales? Why should we be content with the story produced on the assembly line? It is necessary to give the protagonists the some disadvantage. Defeats, quarrels, betrayals, misdeeds, sacrifices of several of the more major characters, and even some almost desperate situations should be added. Victory can be easy, but it can't always be easy, like Nelson of Trafalgar and Napoleon of Wagram. Add a bit of luck and twists, you have the chance to create a story that's truly emotionally appealing and readable. While the idea may be overly crazy, it's exactly what I, someone who has read some of the classics thinks, not to show off knowledge.
Refresh my memory, was the Northern Parliament ever communist in the lore?
EDIT: War in the comments section, engage at your own risk
One loading screen mentions the Northern Parliament being "founded on collectivistic ideals", but I don't think they explicitly mention communism. Also, the collection archives mentions a Cold War between the Eagle Union and Northern Parliament, which might also have an ideological component mirroring real life
One loading screen mentions the Northern Parliament being "founded on collectivistic ideals", but I don't think they explicitly mention communism. Also, the collection archives mentions a Cold War between the Eagle Union and Northern Parliament, which might also have an ideological component mirroring real life
You know, we could have avoided a lot of grief if this had been brought up first.