>But we are used to it

Weird flex but ok.

Russians literally cannot go on through a century without fucking themself over

Some russian brainwashed propaganda.

Certainly, if he cannot afford most necessities due to sanctions, he is still well fed (in the words of others)

Interesting to use the death of children in Donbas to argue for support of an invasion that has killed Ukrainian children and forced millions more from their homes. Supposedly 2 million as refugees that have left Ukraine and another 2.5 million within Ukraine that have been displaced from their homes.

If this was true, the Russsians have badly botched their information campaign and failed hard with their propaganda machine in the West.

I'm from Russia (Moscow region) too and i say - kill Donetsk children not ZSU, they killed by russian occupation officers in DNR like Igor Strelkov

When a war is set there are not good or bad guys. Those are only justifications to continue the war on without remorse (from the countries involved) or regret (about the others affected). The U.S. for example has invaded more territories than Russia under the excuse of "peace".

I won't side with any of them. I just wish this conflict ends as soon as possible so again civilians can be at peace.

I don't give a shit if Adolf Hitler himself is revived and in charge of Ukraine. His fucking country is invading another sovereign state. We condemned the United States for doing this crap in 2002 with the Iraq War. This man's country is invading another sovereign nation; that's the end of the fucking argument. You're invading. You're the aggressor. You're violating the law. That's it. By this moron's logic, the day Russian proxy forces shot down MH17, the nations who had anyone on board had a right to go to war with these tools. If I ever meet this artist, I'm going to hang up my right to beat him half to death by using the excuse that one of my countrymen died in that tragedy, so fuck him.

rom_collector said:

When a war is set there are not good or bad guys. Those are only justifications to continue the war on without remorse (from the countries involved) or regret (about the others affected). The U.S. for example has invaded more territories than Russia under the excuse of "peace".

I won't side with any of them. I just wish this conflict ends as soon as possible so again civilians can be at peace.

One honest comment amid this sea of ​​idiocy...

ithekro said:

If this was true, the Russsians have badly botched their information campaign and failed hard with their propaganda machine in the West.

Everything is very simple. Who owns the largest media - he wins the information war. Remember the first world war. How the British and French media made monsters out of German soldiers. Who cut off the arms and legs of children after the capture of the Belgian city

When RT started to adopt the animé style?

This is what propaganda does to you.

Please try not to blame the Russian civilians too much; they are at the mercy of their government.

Fun fact: This guy deleted everything not related to the Russo-Ukrainian war in his accounts. Every piece of art, gone. He even deleted everything in his FurAffinity account.

rom_collector said:

When a war is set there are not good or bad guys. Those are only justifications to continue the war on without remorse (from the countries involved) or regret (about the others affected). The U.S. for example has invaded more territories than Russia under the excuse of "peace".

I won't side with any of them. I just wish this conflict ends as soon as possible so again civilians can be at peace.

it's not hard to figure out who are the baddies. Putin has crossed a red line that should not have been crossed. This plan is just the 2nd part of what he started in 2014, electoral fraud and Crimean occupation first, then send weapons and terrorist in Donbas region to destabilize and destroy the whole country from inside. He is not interested in peace. It's just a little evil man.

Tesomu said:

I am proud that my country has finally shown that it must be reckoned with.

Pretty sure the opposite happened with them losing 36k troops in like a week and subsequently becoming a laughingstock with the amount military blunders they keep doing. For instance the amazing strategy of securing Chernobyl and losing your soldiers to radiation sickness.

I think it's fair to ask about who created these Ukrainian breakaway regions. If you look at their leaders and commanders, you can see that most of them were Russians with ties to FSB. It's insane to blame someone on something you really made yourself.
Russians started all this mess, so they don't have any moral high ground at all.

Good looking image with a fucking bad message.

ChernyLitvin said:

Everything is very simple. Who owns the largest media - he wins the information war. Remember the first world war. How the British and French media made monsters out of German soldiers. Who cut off the arms and legs of children after the capture of the Belgian city

As a Belgian I would like to note that the problem in world war 1 wasn't really the conduct of soldiers but on a higher scale. A lot of industrial equipment was taken or destroyed and after the world ended Belgian only got a pittance as a result of the negotiations due to basically being a token member. The media war isn't going to really help Ukraine since it will turn into the larger powers that be airing their grievances at each other.

rom_collector said:

When a war is set there are not good or bad guys. Those are only justifications to continue the war on without remorse (from the countries involved) or regret (about the others affected). The U.S. for example has invaded more territories than Russia under the excuse of "peace".

I won't side with any of them. I just wish this conflict ends as soon as possible so again civilians can be at peace.

I have a friend who volunteered to help in Ukraine (loading water trucks until returning back home in the Balkans). This was part of the humanitarian assistance from abroad. Russia targeted them too and made sure those supplies had to be worked for. It is hard to establish moral equivalence when Ukraine has been invaded and is on the defensive, and when Russia is clearly not attacking purely military targets.

Whataboutism, if explored to its conclusion, is saying that previous atrocities justify current atrocities.

https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/russia-ukraine-crisis-almost-300-people-buried-in-mass-grave-in-bucha-outside-kyiv-mayor-2859291
Or, people running literal Einsatzgruppen accusing others of nazism.
Or: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EF1SoSRUEAAzDd2.jpg

Saladofstones said:

I have a friend who volunteered to help in Ukraine (loading water trucks until returning back home in the Balkans). This was part of the humanitarian assistance from abroad. Russia targeted them too and made sure those supplies had to be worked for. It is hard to establish moral equivalence when Ukraine has been invaded and is on the defensive, and when Russia is clearly not attacking purely military targets.

Whataboutism, if explored to its conclusion, is saying that previous atrocities justify current atrocities.

For what I care any information coming from any sources are unconfirmed. There also exist a possibility of them being propaganda or false, I won't stand for any side. Also, of course they will target civilians, it's not like military forces are a hundred percent of the country. Russia choose to take over Ukraine and be on the offensive, but Ukraine civilians choosed to stay in, put resistence and kill as many Russians as possible. Both are doing bad things for different reasons.

The winner of this war will decide who was the good side, it always does. The truth is anyone involved on a war commits horrible atrocities it doesn't matter the side you are on. I hope this ends soon so anyone who ran away nor could not do it in time can be at peace again.

Cheesecakes99 said:

If I recall, the mass graves are popping up because Russia isn't coming back for their dead and the rotting bodies can spread disease.

rom_collector said:

For what I care any information coming from any sources are unconfirmed. There also exist a possibility of them being propaganda or false, I won't stand for any side. Also, of course they will target civilians, it's not like military forces are a hundred percent of the country. Russia choose to take over Ukraine and be on the offensive, but Ukraine civilians choosed to stay in, put resistence and kill as many Russians as possible. Both are doing bad things for different reasons.

The winner of this war will decide who was the good side, it always does. The truth is anyone involved on a war commits horrible atrocities it doesn't matter the side you are on. I hope this ends soon so anyone who ran away nor could not do it in time can be at peace again.

Of course they chose to stay and resist! Don't compare defending your home from invaders with invading, as if they're all villains just because they didn't just abandon their country for Russia to take. When Ukraine retaliates by invading Russia and torching homes, then you can act like Ukraine has anything to answer for.

"History is told by the victors" does not work the same way it did even 100 years ago. Russia invading Ukraine is not some secret only those involved know. No matter what yarns Russia tries to spin, whether they win or lose, the entire world already knows Russia invaded Ukraine.

darkspire91 said:

If I recall, the mass graves are popping up because Russia isn't coming back for their dead and the rotting bodies can spread disease.

The Russian dead and wounded lying around is because these "geniuses" with their leet stormtroopers can't even fight Ukrainian militia with drone bombs without ending up routing or generating 60 mile traffic jams.
The mass graves is because the same Russians are going around with Einsatzgruppen putting bullets (or 30 mm AP from a BMP2) into the necks of random Ukrainian men, women and children.

blindVigil said:

Russia invading Ukraine is not some secret only those involved know. No matter what yarns Russia tries to spin, whether they win or lose, the entire world already knows Russia invaded Ukraine.

I'm not too sure about that. The U.S. has always gotten away with being on the offensive of any war. If I consider only Russia being the bad guy for taking the offensive then so is the U.S. I reserve my right to stay neutral on this mess.

rom_collector said:

I'm not too sure about that. The U.S. has always gotten away with being on the offensive of any war. If I consider only Russia being the bad guy for taking the offensive then so is the U.S. I reserve my right to stay neutral on this mess.

Defending this naked act of aggression with this shitty whataboutism can only be described as the act of Quislings.

rom_collector said:

I'm not too sure about that. The U.S. has always gotten away with being on the offensive of any war. If I consider only Russia being the bad guy for taking the offensive then so is the U.S. I reserve my right to stay neutral on this mess.

Who here is saying the US isn't the bad guy in Iraq? Or Vietnam, or Central America, or even Afghanistan? Just because no one (except the locals) have actually stopped our aggressions doesn't mean everyone doesn't know we did it.

rom_collector said:

Russia choose to take over Ukraine and be on the offensive, but Ukraine civilians choosed to stay in, put resistence and kill as many Russians as possible. Both are doing bad things for different reasons.

I've seen an awful lot of ridiculous "both sides bad" arguments since 2016, but equating an invading military force with the civilians fighting tooth-and-nail to protect their homeland has got to be the dumbest one I've ever seen. So congrats, I guess.

Artist said:
We will stand.

Sorry sunshine, but it sounds funny to have you play the tough guy when you're drawing from your house and pretending you're as badass as the soldiers invading another country.

Artist said:
You help Nazi Ukraine

Ha, yes, Morelli's special.
- We do not want war.
- The opposite party alone is guilty of war.
- The enemy is inherently evil and resembles the devil.
- We defend a noble cause, not our own interests.(Just War theory)
- The enemy commits atrocities on purpose; our mishaps are involuntary.
- The enemy uses forbidden weapons.
- We suffer small losses, those of the enemy are enormous.
- Recognized artists and intellectuals back our cause.
- Our cause is sacred.
- All who doubt our propaganda are traitors.

How many of these have Russians used so far? Have they tried to justify their war as some kind of liberation of "the people" from the very mean baby-eating satanist nazi Ukrainian yet? Because calling Ukraine nazis is already very retarded.
And I know Russians already start to call traitors whoever disagree with the invasion of Ukraine.

rom_collector said:

For what I care any information coming from any sources are unconfirmed. There also exist a possibility of them being propaganda or false, I won't stand for any side. Also, of course they will target civilians, it's not like military forces are a hundred percent of the country. Russia choose to take over Ukraine and be on the offensive, but Ukraine civilians choosed to stay in, put resistence and kill as many Russians as possible. Both are doing bad things for different reasons.

The winner of this war will decide who was the good side, it always does. The truth is anyone involved on a war commits horrible atrocities it doesn't matter the side you are on. I hope this ends soon so anyone who ran away nor could not do it in time can be at peace again.

This is an impressive amount of contrarianism. Going back to Belgium, "It is a bad thing that Germany invaded Belgium but the French invaded Prussia in the past so its all the same. Belgium isn't full of soldiers, so its normal that civilians get killed, but Belgium chose to defend itself so any German soldiers they kill is just as bad. I really hope there is peace and all the people without a home now can go back home after its burned to the ground and be at peace now even though I don't think Belgium should defend itself nor should other people fight for them so who knows how this will go."

To the artist, I'd just like to say: Odpierdol się.

If Russia invades Ukraine, as far as Rom_collector is concerned, that's the perfect time to blame America somehow.

If children die in deliberate attacks on hospitals? Blame it on America somehow.

Covid 19? Severe weather? Your favorite team lose the World Cup? Something something America somehow.

If there's any kind of flame war on Danbooru, Rom_collector will rush into it to try to force the topic to America (or whichever other user he has his petty grudge against today) no matter how nonsensical it is.

When people disagree with Rom_collector, he'll accuse them of being "American" as an insult, even when they write with clear Commonwealth slang and spellings.

I get the sense that whenever Rom_collector actually is forced to go outside, he just randomly slaps toys out of children's hands and then tries to "justify" it by blaming America.

Mithiwithi said:

Who here is saying the US isn't the bad guy in Iraq? Or Vietnam, or Central America, or even Afghanistan? Just because no one (except the locals) have actually stopped our aggressions doesn't mean everyone doesn't know we did it.

The main reason for the references to any previous wars is this seems like the same type of warmongering from our governments and it seems like a lot of people bought into it. I don't want another foreign war for something as vague as "democracy" like the "freedom" of yesteryear. The Ukrainians (the people) are caught in a nasty game of geopolitics between Russia and the US, it's a pretty awful position to be in. However I'd rather avoid another foreign war given our track record so far.

Artist

Gotta wonder if the FSB has gotten to this guy and relegated him to Untermenschen status because he used to draw yuri lewds
And as we all know yuri lewds makes Putin and the FSB go beserk.

LustyForBusty said:

The Ukrainians (the people) are caught in a nasty game of geopolitics between Russia and the US, it's a pretty awful position to be in.

Putin and Russians who subscribe to the same ideology, never viewed Ukraine as an independent country from Russia. Even without the US or NATO, any other efforts by Ukrainians to simply be an independent nation would have gone this same route of Russia invading them.

rom_collector:
I won't stand for any side.

One side is putting bullets in the necks of women and children and dumping them in mass graves, shooting up elderly people in civvie cars with 30 mm AP, dropping 1000 pound bombs on literal children.
The other side is defending their own goddamn country, and killing these barbarians.
And you won't take a side.
What does this tell us about your moral aptitude?

NWF_Renim said:

Putin and Russians who subscribe to the same ideology, never viewed Ukraine as an independent country from Russia. Even without the US or NATO, any other efforts by Ukrainians to simply be an independent nation would have gone this same route of Russia invading them.

If you're going to go there why didn't the Russians also invade Belarus? The current Ukrainian government is the result of Euromaidan, which at the very least had some western backing and that led to the annexation of Crimea and the separatists regions. If Euromaidan didn't happen, this wouldn't have happened.

LustyForBusty said:

If you're going to go there why didn't the Russians also invade Belarus? The current Ukrainian government is the result of Euromaidan, which at the very least had some western backing and that led to the annexation of Crimea and the separatists regions. If Euromaidan didn't happen, this wouldn't have happened.

Because godforbid people disinviting by every means necessary a foreign-installed corrupt muppet.

NWF_Renim said:

Putin and Russians who subscribe to the same ideology, never viewed Ukraine as an independent country from Russia. Even without the US or NATO, any other efforts by Ukrainians to simply be an independent nation would have gone this same route of Russia invading them.

It really wasn't NATO that led to Ukraine being invaded. Russia invaded in 2014 because Ukraine overthrew Putin's puppet government dictator. The main reason Putin invaded this time was because Ukraine was getting close to the EU, not the US, and one of the first things Zelensky did as the invasion started was to symbolically show himself signing papers to apply for Ukraine to be part of the EU, not part of NATO. Putin wasn't mad about anything the US was doing until the sanctions hit, he was mad that there was a functional democracy providing a stark alternative to his kleptocracy right on his doorstep, where enough Russian-speakers were able to directly tell Russians how much better their country would be if all the wealth in their nation wasn't being looted by the same group of thieves.

Cheesecakes99 said:

What does this tell us about your moral aptitude?

It tells me that I won't fall under any propaganda so governments won't manipulate me to participate on a war, making all this even bigger and worse. They won't make me believe all Russians are evil nor every citizen that decided to stay killing Russians in sight is a poor soul that needs help. Previous war history had taught me not all Germans, Japanese, Afgans, Vietnamese or Iraquis are bad. But as long as they make you believe that, you will accept they being killed like terrorists.

Evil is not hidden behind a nationality, it never were. I won't stand for any side. If a find a Russian or Ukraine over my country in need I would help them if possible, I won't deny it based on their nationality.

The Russian people have to be told the truth. They need to understand what their government and military has done. The playbook of Putin's reads an awful lot like one Adolf Hitler's playbook about reclaiming all of Germany lost back in the 1930s.

Even worse, its be five weeks. Five! And the Russian military is going for 1944 levels of crimes against humanity.

It may be the only way to save the Russian people.

rom_collector said:

It tells me that I won't fall under any propaganda

The person constantly spewing propaganda says this?!

You are not immune to propaganda.

NWSiaCB said:

The person constantly spewing propaganda says this?!

You are not immune to propaganda.

And for that reason I won't side with anyone based on what I'm told. For example not all Americans are bad either, but previous elections showed half of them would follow a racist xenophobic leader if they could. This situation could be even worse if Trump were still president, more that it already is with Biden. The truth is you can't trust on any side anymore.

LustyForBusty said:

The current Ukrainian government is the result of Euromaidan, which at the very least had some western backing and that led to the annexation of Crimea and the separatists regions.

None of which absolves Russia for its present-day actions in any way. It ultimately doesn't matter who supported Euromaidan, or whether Ukraine is pushing for closer ties with NATO and the EU, or how upset Putin is that his puppet Yanukovych fled Kyiv and left a western-leaning democracy in his wake. Russia gets to have zero say in the treaties and internal affairs of other sovereign countries, period*. Nothing Ukraine or any other country has done gives Russia any right to carve out swaths of the country to annex for itself, let alone attempt to topple the government altogether.

* this is true for all countries, but it's particularly true for Ukraine, Kazakhstan, and Belarus, as the Budapest Memorandum which Russia signed as a condition of these countries' nuclear disarmament specifically forbids its signatories from interfering with their sovereignty, whether by force or economic sanctions.

iridescent_slime said:

None of which absolves Russia for its present-day actions in any way. It ultimately doesn't matter who supported Euromaidan, or whether Ukraine is pushing for closer ties with NATO and the EU, or how upset Putin is that his puppet Yanukovych fled Kyiv and left a western-leaning democracy in his wake. Russia gets to have zero say in the treaties and internal affairs of other sovereign countries, period*. Nothing Ukraine or any other country has done gives Russia any right to carve out swaths of the country to annex for itself, let alone attempt to topple the government altogether.

It doesn't absolve them, but that's their reasoning if an alliance (which sole purpose is to oppose you) of nations is slowly encircling you it shouldn't be surprising when they retaliate, when the whole started over a pretty likely western backed coup in Euromaidan. However I just really don't want to potentially die for something when it's actually just the scheming of elites instead of actual values.

LustyForBusty said:

It doesn't absolve them, but that's their reasoning if an alliance (which sole purpose is to oppose you) of nations is slowly encircling you it shouldn't be surprising when they retaliate, when the whole started over a pretty likely western backed coup in Euromaidan. However I just really don't want to potentially die for something when it's actually just the scheming of elites instead of actual values.

Criminal enterprises who hire bands of rapists to rape their way through Ukraine don't get to justify why they are raping their way through a country. The only thing they should get is a court of law, a death sentence and a short, sharp drop.

Cheesecakes99 said:

Criminal enterprises who hire bands of rapists to rape their way through Ukraine don't get to justify why they are raping their way through a country. The only thing they should get is a court of law, a death sentence and a short, sharp drop.

Bad people do bad things big shock.

They reject DAESH-themed art, but accept this? What the fuck is this shit?!

LustyForBusty said:

It doesn't absolve them, but that's their reasoning if an alliance (which sole purpose is to oppose you) of nations is slowly encircling you it shouldn't be surprising when they retaliate, when the whole started over a pretty likely western backed coup in Euromaidan. However I just really don't want to potentially die for something when it's actually just the scheming of elites instead of actual values.

I always here this refrain that its a coup, but how does it being a supposed coup justify Russia annexation of Crimea and supporting a separatist movement in Donbas well before Ukraine got any sort of support from the EU?

rom_collector said:

It tells me that I won't fall under any propaganda so governments won't manipulate me to participate on a war, making all this even bigger and worse. They won't make me believe all Russians are evil nor every citizen that decided to stay killing Russians in sight is a poor soul that needs help.

Can you elaborate on your point about Ukrainian citizens staying? Because as it is, its a rather bizarre false equivalence.

Saladofstones said:

I always here this refrain that its a coup, but how does it being a supposed coup justify Russia annexation of Crimea and supporting a separatist movement in Donbas well before Ukraine got any sort of support from the EU?

Because of a Russian speaking majority/minority in those area. However the real reason is clearly for western intervention perceived or otherwise. Their justifications are pretty weak, but that's usually how it goes with wars.

Kremlin's troll brigade is hard at work earning their wooden rubles, I see.

LustyForBusty said:

It doesn't absolve them, but that's their reasoning if an alliance (which sole purpose is to oppose you) of nations is slowly encircling you it shouldn't be surprising when they retaliate, when the whole started over a pretty likely western backed coup in Euromaidan. However I just really don't want to potentially die for something when it's actually just the scheming of elites instead of actual values.

I don't believe there are any words in any language to describe how stupid of a take this is, but I would love to be proven wrong. "Retaliate"?! Against what?! No one invaded Russia! No one even threatened them. This is not "retaliation", this is aggression.

I cannot believe how hard some people are trying to feign neutrality so they can pretend like Putin isn't an evil slimelord.

blindVigil said:

I don't believe there are any words in any language to describe how stupid of a take this is, but I would love to be proven wrong. "Retaliate"?! Against what?! No one invaded Russia! No one even threatened them. This is not "retaliation", this is aggression.

I cannot believe how hard some people are trying to feign neutrality so they can pretend like Putin isn't an evil slimelord.

Retaliate against NATO expansion. They were going to snap at some point and this is the breaking point. You can act like it's surprising, but it's not; they see it as enemy on their doorstep.

LustyForBusty said:

Retaliate against NATO expansion. They were going to snap at some point and this is the breaking point. You can act like it's surprising, but it's not; they see it as enemy on their doorstep.

Who cares if it's surprising? It's still shitty. No one attacked Russia, they had nothing to retaliate against. At this point, I think you, and Rom Collector for that matter, might as well drop the act and just come out and say that you don't care about the Ukrainians, or take it a step further and just say you support Russia's actions. Why else would you be trying so hard to downplay what they're doing by pointing to bad things other countries have done, as if that changes anything? There's an obvious bad actor here, absolutely nothing gray about it, and both of you would rather villainize the victims and justify the aggressors.

blindVigil said:

Who cares if it's surprising? It's still shitty. No one attacked Russia, they had nothing to retaliate against. At this point, I think you, and Rom Collector for that matter, might as well drop the act and just come out and say that you don't care about the Ukrainians, or take it a step further and just say you support Russia's actions. Why else would you be trying so hard to downplay what they're doing by pointing to bad things other countries have done, as if that changes anything? There's an obvious bad actor here, absolutely nothing gray about it, and both of you would rather villainize the victims and justify the aggressors.

And daily reminder now that the Russian mask has come undone: To support Russian "actions" (or more correctly: wanton barbarism) means to supports literal genocide by rape and mass slaughter.
I.e. we're no longer merely dealing with a "bad" actor here. We're dealing with outright evil.

rom_collector said:

And for that reason I won't side with anyone based on what I'm told. For example not all Americans are bad either, but previous elections showed half of them would follow a racist xenophobic leader if they could. This situation could be even worse if Trump were still president, more that it already is with Biden. The truth is you can't trust on any side anymore.

Do you honestly think you've just been taking some neutral point of view, that you're not overtly rehashing propaganda you've heard from elsewhere? It's honestly hilarious if that's how delusional you've become.

Do you think it's just a normal, neutral, completely apolitical way to talk to just say, for example, "It's a sunny day, but the weatherman says there's a 20% chance of rain in the afternoon and America is guilty of many crimes."

rom_collector said:

When a war is set there are not good or bad guys. Those are only justifications to continue the war on without remorse (from the countries involved) or regret (about the others affected). The U.S. for example has invaded more territories than Russia under the excuse of "peace".

I won't side with any of them. I just wish this conflict ends as soon as possible so again civilians can be at peace.

What you are doing right there? It's called muddying the waters.

When the Nazis were being prosecuted for the Holocaust, they brought up how some of their eugenics ideas were copied from American eugenicists. Sure, that's true, and those were evil people in the US that did a lot of harm to US citizens and should have been stopped sooner, but it's an irrelevant truth to what the Nazis did and how they should have been treated.

Hell, it's the same defense we here on Danbooru explicitly deny - "Why are you deleting this art when there's other art that's worse?!" ("Oh, in that case, why don't you tell me what that art is, so I can flag that bad art too, then?") I dare you to try telling a cop that he's not allowed to stop you for speeding just because he hasn't caught all the murderers in the world yet, and that clearly nobody is allowed to fix ANY problems until EVERY problem can be solved all at once. It sure seems like that's a request that no problems ever be solved, especially ones caused by the same bad actors making that request, doesn't it? It's almost like this is the last "excuse" of the guilty for a reason...

Muddying the waters is the strategy of those who know they are guilty or are defending those who are clearly guilty on the facts, so with no other recourse, they attack the concept that there even ARE knowable facts in this big, crazy unknowable world. It has literally been the words out of Putin's mouth (besides calling everyone else Nazis while he, himself, has been funding every extremist right and Neo-Nazi movement in the world) to say that all his actions are "justified" because something something America did a thing he didn't like in the past. Nevermind that this whole conflict has nothing to do with America. Putin invaded Ukraine because Ukraine was becoming a successful democracy and making financial ties with Europe. Putin wanted to invade Ukraine no matter what the US did because the US was never involved in any way other than being a handy rhetorical excuse up until the invasion started, and Biden threw some sanctions down just to look like he's doing something.

What you are spreading is not "staying away from propaganda", it is the Russian propaganda. You are not neutral, you are an agent of Russian propaganda, and if you genuinely don't believe you are, that's even more pathetic.

Probably I didn't explain myself well, I was just giving U.S. propaganda examples that could be true or not. Unless I live in Russia or Ukraine I couldn't care less about who is the good or bad guy because I do not live in there to confirm them.

It's no use to point fingers about who is the bad guy because both are victims of their own governments. It needs two to be a fight and some of both are willing to kill each other, I couldn't care less about them. On the contrary, there are those who choosed to run away... or they could not because they are apt and obliged to fight it, I care for those.

Five years ago, I lived for two years next to a run away Ukranian couple who traveled every half year somewhere in America before they dissaperared again. Under that time I help them in everything possible I could. If the opportunity arises (and it will because I'm seeing Russians/Ukranians more frecuently around here) I'm willing to do it again.

Under that same timeline some blocks away there was this another "Russian" guy (who turned out to be from Ukraine) who got linch mob for filming himself spewing racial slurs against the people he lived among on social networks, but not before stabbing and killing a teenager in the process. The guy had Nazi symbols tattoed everywhere BTW. An example that shows evil doesn't know about frontiers unlike your government makes you believe.

I won't downplay what Russians had done, but is it all Russians? We all know they are not, yet you prefer to ignore that so you can be comfortable with them being killed. The same applies to Russia killing Ukranians.

blindVigil said:

Who cares if it's surprising? It's still shitty. No one attacked Russia, they had nothing to retaliate against. At this point, I think you, and Rom Collector for that matter, might as well drop the act and just come out and say that you don't care about the Ukrainians, or take it a step further and just say you support Russia's actions. Why else would you be trying so hard to downplay what they're doing by pointing to bad things other countries have done, as if that changes anything? There's an obvious bad actor here, absolutely nothing gray about it, and both of you would rather villainize the victims and justify the aggressors.

I don't care about Ukrainians more than I care about Americans, call that evil if you want. The reason I'm bringing up our role in it and the Russian position is because it seems like we (basically just the United States Government) started it. I find that disgusting they'd risk the lives of millions of people just for cold war era mindset; and it could easily spiral into WW3. I simply do not want a war in Ukraine it doesn't seem like it's actually about values more about business interests of our elites. Zelensky has not made a good case for Ukraine either since he's clearly trying to get western intervention (just look at the fearmongering of Chernobyl) and refusing any sort of potential for peace causing even more suffering.

LustyForBusty said:

I don't care about Ukrainians more than I care about Americans, call that evil if you want. The reason I'm bringing up our role in it and the Russian position is because it seems like we (basically just the United States Government) started it. I find that disgusting they'd risk the lives of millions of people just for cold war era mindset; and it could easily spiral into WW3. I simply do not want a war in Ukraine it doesn't seem like it's actually about values more about business interests of our elites. Zelensky has not made a good case for Ukraine either since he's clearly trying to get western intervention (just look at the fearmongering of Chernobyl) and refusing any sort of potential for peace causing even more suffering.

At this stage, when the Russian Ministry of Propaganda is writing their own Wannsee Protocols about wiping Ukraine out as a ethnical, historical and cultural entity... to stand in silence over this is to be a Quisling, a collaborateur.

Cheesecakes99 said:

At this stage, when the Russian Ministry of Propaganda is writing their own Wannsee Protocols about wiping Ukraine out as a ethnical, historical and cultural entity... to stand in silence over this is to be a Quisling, a collaborateur.

And the Chinese are geocoding the Uyghur and we still buy their cheap plastic crap, or the war in Yemen that's probably killing way more civilians than what's happening in Ukraine and we're still buying Saudi oil and letting them buy our weapons. The reason for western interest in Ukraine is because our elites obsession with their cold war mindset and they have to lose more than it being about the evils that are being committed.

LustyForBusty said:

And the Chinese are geocoding the Uyghur and we still buy their cheap plastic crap, or the war in Yemen that's probably killing way more civilians than what's happening in Ukraine and we're still buying Saudi oil and letting them buy our weapons. The reason for western interest in Ukraine is because our elites obsession with their cold war mindset and they have to lose more than it being about the evils that are being committed.

When confronted with Russian confessions for genocide you misdirect, divert attention away from and argue that the victims of this genocide should submit to their genociders.
What's next for you? "Davon haben wir nichts gewusst!"?

Cheesecakes99 said:

When confronted with Russian confessions for genocide you misdirect, divert attention away from and argue that the victims of this genocide should submit to their genociders.
What's next for you? "Davon haben wir nichts gewusst!"?

It's not misdirection it's pointing out the unwillingness to look at other atrocities currently going, in favor of Ukraine to warmonger.

The amount of shittakes in this comment section are hilariously sad.
Also funny to bring up "western expansion", when the ukranians themselves wanted to be part of NATO and EU. Still mad that other eastern countries wanted joined NATO (just like Putin did, back in the days)? Everyone seems to forget what the ukrainians want, when they can just blame US for every shit that happens in the world. Additionally, with Putin attacking Ukrain, he gave the best reason, why NATO is still a needed alliance.

Best would be to leave the discussion here. There is no good coming from people calling themselves "neutral" who are blindly following russian propaganda.

LustyForBusty said:

It's not misdirection it's pointing out the unwillingness to look at other atrocities currently going, in favor of Ukraine to warmonger.

>Ukrainian warmongering
You do realise who's up there talking about wiping Ukraine off the face of the planet yes? Or are you ready to confess to being a collaborateur?

Cheesecakes99 said:

>Ukrainian warmongering
You do realise who's up there talking about wiping Ukraine off the face of the planet yes? Or are you ready to confess to being a collaborateur?

Jesus Christ can you read? It's WARMONGERING from THE WEST to GET INVOLVED in Ukraine.

LustyForBusty said:

Jesus Christ can you read? It's WARMONGERING from THE WEST to GET INVOLVED in Ukraine.

So... Russia invading Ukrainian territory is... NOT... warmongering?

punished_K said:

So... Russia invading Ukrainian territory is... NOT... warmongering?

War is bad. I don't want more nations to get involved in the war, because that only increases the suffering. I don't think I can put it in simpler terms.

Yemen and China actions, if I recall, are considered parts of civil wars, and thus, while tragic, is not something the international community has much of a say in.

Ukraine has been invaded by another power (Russia), an act of aggression against another nation that is part of the United Nations. At that point it is absolutely something the international community can get involved with as one of their members just attacked another member without just cause or say so from the United Nations. Add to this what amounts to genocide against said nation is exactly what the United Nations was founded to prevent from happening again after World War II.

It is the job of the United Nations to prevent this sort of thing from happening, and if possible, end the conflict.

You are from Russia. Im from Luhansk.
What can you even imagine what and how happened in these regions for real? Watched on TV? Or read public VK "Anti Maidan"? Or maybe your mom's "friend" told you?

ithekro said:

Yemen and China actions, if I recall, are considered parts of civil wars, and thus, while tragic, is not something the international community has much of a say in.

Ukraine has been invaded by another power (Russia), an act of aggression against another nation that is part of the United Nations. At that point it is absolutely something the international community can get involved with as one of their members just attacked another member without just cause or say so from the United Nations. Add to this what amounts to genocide against said nation is exactly what the United Nations was founded to prevent from happening again after World War II.

It is the job of the United Nations to prevent this sort of thing from happening, and if possible, end the conflict.

And people say I'm downplaying stuff and you reduce a genocide of ethnic (at least in the case of the Uyghurs) and religious (the killing Yemenis civilians probably has some to do with the Shia Sunni divide) minorities to just a civil war. I doubt the Russians are actively killing civilians or intending to commit a genocide. The "international community" (it would basically just be the west) could intervene (with military action because international law is basically worthless with the some consequences. We're trying economic, however that clearly hasn't work yet anyway and it may have even backfired), but I doubt it would actually be in the interests of the people of getting involved.

LustyForBusty said: I doubt the Russians are actively killing civilians or intending to commit a genocide.

You doubt their intention for genocide? When we have direct confessions from the Russian State itself?
You sir, are a useful idiot. A quisling.

What do you feel when you read the stuff ria shat out yesterday? Because it makes me feel fucking depressed.

Russians have fucking zero shame. Perpetual victim complex too.

Cheesecakes99 said:

You doubt their intention for genocide? When we have direct confessions from the Russian State itself?
You sir, are a useful idiot. A quisling.

What do you feel when you read the stuff ria shat out yesterday? Because it makes me feel fucking depressed.

Is this widely held position of the Russians, or is it just an overly zealous journalist looking for praise from the regime? (Also I didn't read much of it the first, because the first bit it seems like rambling about denazification which I agree is a pretty weak or entirely invalid reason for starting a war, but you have the Azov guys so it has some weight). Anyway it still wouldn't affect my opinion of the war that much, because my primary concern is sending my people to die for something I'm sure wouldn't be for stopping a genocide. Because like I've said why don't we care about the Uyghurs, or basically any other genocide that's happened since WW2.

Flag this and ask moderators to fuck off this artist from site!
Flag this and ask moderators to fuck off this artist from site!
Flag this and ask moderators to fuck off this artist from site!
Flag this and ask moderators to fuck off this artist from site!

@artviewer73 stop flagging pics just because of what they depict. Only thing you'll get by doing that is a ban.

Most of the people here get it right but some are confused.
The picture is about year 2014 when the war started not 2022.
The shell in her hands is reference to this photo: https://imgur.com/a/Ozm6EeW

The vatnik cries out in pain as he strikes you.

"Русский военный корабль, иди нахуй."

pantsukiller said:

Most of the people here get it right but some are confused.
The picture is about year 2014 when the war started not 2022.
The shell in her hands is reference to this photo: https://imgur.com/a/Ozm6EeW

Can you provide a link with context for that photo? From an independent source, preferably, we all know that most Russian news agencies aren't particularly trustworthy.

And on a related note, something quite relevant to this image happened today. Two Russian rockets hit railway station in Kramatorsk, eastern Ukraine, it was used to evacuate civilians from the region. At least 50 died, including 5 children, and more that 100 are wounded. You can find more details in this article, or wikipedia page, or check some other news websites.

What is interesting, one of the missiles had "ЗА ДЕТЕЙ" written on it, which can be translated as "for children", or "on behalf of children".

Updooted

Fuck Russia. All my homies hate russia. I cheer every dead Russian.

[deleted]

Byakushi said:

I don't give a shit if Adolf Hitler himself is revived and in charge of Ukraine. His fucking country is invading another sovereign state. We condemned the United States for doing this crap in 2002 with the Iraq War. This man's country is invading another sovereign nation; that's the end of the fucking argument. You're invading. You're the aggressor. You're violating the law. That's it. By this moron's logic, the day Russian proxy forces shot down MH17, the nations who had anyone on board had a right to go to war with these tools. If I ever meet this artist, I'm going to hang up my right to beat him half to death by using the excuse that one of my countrymen died in that tragedy, so fuck him.

U have a literal childs view of morality. "B-but Russia broke the rules." The world is not a fairytale

iloveayaka said:

U have a literal childs view of morality. "B-but Russia broke the rules." The world is not a fairytale

Found the 'centrist,' i.e. "I think both sides are equally bad, I am very smart." You're just a passive bystander; you have literally no grounds to be criticizing anyone, ever. So crawl back into your hole and go back to falling in love with the smell of your own farts while contributing absolutely nothing.

[deleted]

[deleted]

Xhydralisk said:

you have literally no grounds to be criticizing anyone

Except Russia right now.

rom_collector said:

When a war is set there are not good or bad guys. Those are only justifications to continue the war on without remorse (from the countries involved) or regret (about the others affected). The U.S. for example has invaded more territories than Russia under the excuse of "peace".

I won't side with any of them. I just wish this conflict ends as soon as possible so again civilians can be at peace.

there is no good or bad. One attack without giving a damn about all international laws and agreements, while others try to defend themselves. so there are no good or bad?

The artist seems to no longer be the hyper patriotic supporter of the war and has deleted all references of support for it.

ithekro said:

The Russian people have to be told the truth. They need to understand what their government and military has done. The playbook of Putin's reads an awful lot like one Adolf Hitler's playbook about reclaiming all of Germany lost back in the 1930s.

Even worse, its be five weeks. Five! And the Russian military is going for 1944 levels of crimes against humanity.

It may be the only way to save the Russian people.

Is your government telling you the truth?
I'm sorry, but I have seen the crap that the Ukrainian military is doing since the very beginning of the hostilities in Ukraine. And they say it according to the methods of the American military.
An example is to cover the BMP2 with a kindergarten, while the children are taken away by adults and know for sure that the Russians will not shoot

This Russian supporter guy accidentally made Ukraine looks cute and badass at the same time.

Hikkulus said:

Is your government telling you the truth?
I'm sorry, but I have seen the crap that the Ukrainian military is doing since the very beginning of the hostilities in Ukraine. And they say it according to the methods of the American military.
An example is to cover the BMP2 with a kindergarten, while the children are taken away by adults and know for sure that the Russians will not shoot

So the Russians attacked civilian sectors of a city, the Ukrainian army evacuated the civilians and fought back against the attacker?

jackie_v138 said:

This Russian supporter guy accidentally made Ukraine looks cute and badass at the same time.

IKR, just like these incredibly badass Chinese propaganda cartoons about Biden and the US in general.