I think that he needlessly overextends the concept across all Youkai, though. I've never read or heard about an artifact spirit that needs to eat human flesh, or even eat at all.
Except that "Harmless and Moe" concept (while not being 111% correct) is hundreds of times closer to canon than this silly exaggeration. Well, some people consider it to be funny, so why not? Anything goes if it's interesting.
Well it's a thousand time better than the false notion of "Harmless and Moe youkai girls"
You're entitled to your own opinion, but don't go around saying that something is a thousand time better than something simply because you disagree with it. As a matter of fact, I don't like Zounose's stories. Kinda like Asatsuki-Dou, it seems to me he does grimdark stories just for the sake of being grimdark. Kinda like "harmless and moe youkai" authors write stories just for the sake of being cute and adorable.
In both case, you have the author taking a trait, and encouraging it. Zounose relies on the "outsiders often falls prey to youkai" line. Does that make him different? Yeah. Does that make him "a-thousand-time-better"? Bloody hell no. If being edgy and grimdark was enough to be a thousand-time-better, then Warhammer 40K would be the best thing in the world. And yet...
You're entitled to your own opinion, but don't go around saying that something is a thousand time better than something simply because you disagree with it. As a matter of fact, I don't like Zounose's stories. Kinda like Asatsuki-Dou, it seems to me he does grimdark stories just for the sake of being grimdark. Kinda like "harmless and moe youkai" authors write stories just for the sake of being cute and adorable.
In both case, you have the author taking a trait, and encouraging it. Zounose relies on the "outsiders often falls prey to youkai" line. Does that make him different? Yeah. Does that make him "a-thousand-time-better"? Bloody hell no. If being edgy and grimdark was enough to be a thousand-time-better, then Warhammer 40K would be the best thing in the world. And yet...
Zounose's take about how stuff happens in Gensokyo is pretty close to my head-canon. The supernatural world in about every single mythology is full of dangers and man-eating monsters, and in Japan it was pretty much the same. You shouldn't ignore why youkai exist on the first place when reading works about them.
Of course, the deal with Gensokyo is that a lot of youkai there decided to be the little girl. The real world reason for that is that ZUN wants to draw little girls, but that is the kind of stuff that should have in-world reasons too. And whatever these reasons are, they changed the place dynamics: People these days in Gensokyo have all kinds of confused feelings about youkai, and youkai too started to behave differently once everybody was wearing lace and silly hats.
What this means is that treating Rumia as a dumb moé girl is missing part of the picture. Treating Rumia as a man-eater monster is also missing part of the picture. She's both, and I like this artist's take about how both sides coexist.
Although this is probably a far cry from the actual canon, I believe the youkai in touhou (certainly the weaker ones), were known to eat humans on a certain basis. The stronger of the youkai holding back their natural instincts due to accumulating knowledge and experience. On another note, I've read stories way darker than this on danbooru and some way more bloody, this is a nice mix of: 'pleasantly dark' and 'horribly twisted'.
Zounose's take about how stuff happens in Gensokyo is pretty close to my head-canon. The supernatural world in about every single mythology is full of dangers and man-eating monsters, and in Japan it was pretty much the same. You shouldn't ignore why youkai exist on the first place when reading works about them.
Of course, the deal with Gensokyo is that a lot of youkai there decided to be the little girl. The real world reason for that is that ZUN wants to draw little girls, but that is the kind of stuff that should have in-world reasons too. And whatever these reasons are, they changed the place dynamics: People these days in Gensokyo have all kinds of confused feelings about youkai, and youkai too started to behave differently once everybody was wearing lace and silly hats.
What this means is that treating Rumia as a dumb moé girl is missing part of the picture. Treating Rumia as a man-eater monster is also missing part of the picture. She's both, and I like this artist's take about how both sides coexist.
Except that most of the girls in this doujin clearly look disgusted at eating human meat, but they just eat it because why the heck not?
If they eat human meat to survive than I have no problem with it (there's plenty of dark fics out there that deal with these and I'm fine with most of them, in fact...), but the way they just go along with the flow while complaining about it just rub me the wrong way.
Except that most of the girls in this doujin clearly look disgusted at eating human meat, but they just eat it because why the heck not?
If they eat human meat to survive than I have no problem with it (there's plenty of dark fics out there that deal with these and I'm fine with most of them, in fact...), but the way they just go along with the flow while complaining about it just rub me the wrong way.
The reason they look disgusted is more due to the canned human tasting horrible then it was due to they being disgusted about eating humans. That's my take on it at least.
Except that most of the girls in this doujin clearly look disgusted at eating human meat, but they just eat it because why the heck not?
If they eat human meat to survive than I have no problem with it (there's plenty of dark fics out there that deal with these and I'm fine with most of them, in fact...), but the way they just go along with the flow while complaining about it just rub me the wrong way.
They are not disgusted by human meat itself, Rumia was eating a fresh human and Wriggle ate a bit of it too. They looked disgusted because this canned meat tastes really bad, possibly because they use those freaking unhealty outsiders (and canned meat tastes bad anyway).
And yes, almost everything here is canon. In WaHH is stated that Yukari picks some humans from somewhere to feed the youkai, so this whole story is perfectly plausible, excluding maybe the flesh factory.
They are not disgusted by human meat itself, Rumia was eating a fresh human and Wriggle ate a bit of it too. They looked disgusted because this canned meat tastes really bad, possibly because they use those freaking unhealty outsiders (and canned meat tastes bad anyway).
And yes, almost everything here is canon. In WaHH is stated that Yukari picks some humans from somewhere to feed the youkai, so this whole story is perfectly plausible, excluding maybe the flesh factory.
But if the taste is so horrible, then why do they insist on eating them anyway? Rumia was fine chewing down the sausages until Wriggle came to her and invite her to go eat the human meat.
And I know about the whole Yukari and outsiders thing, it just that I don't find the way zounose depicting it... agreeable (sorry for the lack of more proper word)
But if the taste is so horrible, then why do they insist on eating them anyway? Rumia was fine chewing down the sausages until Wriggle came to her and invite her to go eat the human meat.
And I know about the whole Yukari and outsiders thing, it just that I don't find the way zounose depicting it... agreeable (sorry for the lack of more proper word)
If you are hungry enough, you'll eat anything. And as a youkai, if we are to trust what is written in the doujin, only eating human flesh will really sate their hunger.
And yes, almost everything here is canon. In WaHH is stated that Yukari picks some humans from somewhere to feed the youkai, so this whole story is perfectly plausible, excluding maybe the flesh factory.
That's not what happened in WaHH, please don't mislead people. All we have on this subject in canon is actually just a couple of vague/ambiguous pieces and nothing more.
Except that "Harmless and Moe" concept (while not being 111% correct) is hundreds of times closer to canon than this silly exaggeration. Well, some people consider it to be funny, so why not? Anything goes if it's interesting.
Wait, how is that more canon than this?! I'm pretty sure that most of the Youkai's in touhou had at least killed and eaten some humans...
Wait, how is that more canon than this?! I'm pretty sure that most of the Youkai's in touhou had at least killed and eaten some humans...
On some counts, yes, on others no. Youkai in Gensokyo abide by the 'Spellcard' rule and the 'Will not eat humans in the village' rule. What we know before the spellcard rule, is that youkai were a lot more vicious (perhaps more aggressive in eating humans) and were probably exterminated through brutal means. The whole point of the spellcard rule was to make sure there were no issues with death INSIDE the spellcard rule. Since this rule is extended to balance Gensokyo, we can most likely assume that the spellcard rule does not have COMPLETE applications on outsiders, such as humans brought in with specific purposes, or stray wanderers. However, since it's not really specified to how much this rule system applies, it's up in the air as to whether humans are sometimes eaten. It is common knowledge however, that weaker youkai tend to eat humans occasionally but rarely or none at all from the human village.
It's strictly stated that, as a Youkai gets older and more experienced (along with power and knowledge), they will gradually grow out of their old habits such as human eating and learn other things. Such as the case with Yukari and Yuuka, two powerful and long-standing youkai, who have long since abandoned eating humans and behaving like misfits. In the end, it's really difficult to specify whether or not humans are really being eaten or if what ZUN has written is simply and example of behaviour.
In this story: 1) Yukari finds a way to keep her people fed without causing a shitstorm on the outside world with continuous human disappearances: Gensokyo somehow only pulls in humans "that won't be missed", and then the resident youkai eat them. This is canon.
2) To ensure that every youkai gets their share, she industrialises the process and institutes a monthly rations' system. This is Zounose's idea, but it makes a lot of sense. Somebody incredibly intelligent and who takes the "youkai sage" mantle seriously could come with something like that, after foreseeing that without it, big and violent youkai would monopolise all the human flesh and then get rich with it (source: Real World). At that point, people could accuse Yukari of being a socialist, and these people would be right. But there are worse insults.
3) Reality is never as nice as you read in the promotional brochures. Setting for lonely, suicidal humans in the first place and then mashing them into Spam ensures that the taste of the stuff sucks. Still, from the big shots like Yukari and Aya down to tsukumogamis that didn't even learn how to become humanoids yet, everybody actually chows down on the stuff like they're supposed to do. That is a level of commitment to equalitarianism you don't see in real world socialist places and ended looking very endearing.
4) Sometimes, accidents happen. Rumia chanced upon a healthy outsider, killed him at once and was enjoying some nice fresh food at the story's start. What happened is that at least one woman pulled in was missed by someone, and that someone's will to meet her again was strong enough to pull him too. You could wail all that you wanted about the tragedy of it, the truth is that automated, large scale systems make mistakes. You can't eat tuna for the current prices without a dolphin getting the short end of the stick from time to time, to give a similar example. We should all remember that our standard of living has a price.
5) The overall idea I got from reading this is that their system is horrible, with the only things more horrible being all the other possible systems. So in the end, the youkai of Gensokyo end again looking like a surprisingly reasonable people.
That's not what happened in WaHH, please don't mislead people. All we have on this subject in canon is actually just a couple of vague/ambiguous pieces and nothing more.
I need to get up to date with WaHH, but the whole "youkai eat outsiders" is explicit touhou canon:
In this story: 1) Yukari finds a way to keep her people fed without causing a shitstorm on the outside world with continuous human disappearances: Gensokyo somehow only pulls in humans "that won't be missed", and then the resident youkai eat them. This is canon.
Upon actually confirming this, I am slightly taken aback. So in all effect, this story is almost true, except I'm not quite sure a Kappa Industry in turning humans into canned gherkins variants would be canon.
whole "youkai eat outsiders" is explicit touhou canon
No. Touhouwiki aren't written by ZUN, guys. You shouldn't believe literally everything that's written on some wiki page. Try and do some research yourselves, it won't take much time.
And I'll just repeat my previous statement: All we have on this subject in canon is actually just a couple of vague/ambiguous pieces and nothing more.
And keywords here are: just_a_couple and vague/ambiguous.
No. Touhouwiki aren't written by ZUN, guys. You shouldn't believe literally everything that's written on some wiki page. Try and do some research yourselves, it won't take much time.
And I'll just repeat my previous statement: All we have on this subject in canon is actually just a couple of vague/ambiguous pieces and nothing more.
And keywords here are: just_a_couple and vague/ambiguous.
Although the vagueness of it is inconclusive, it goes without a doubt that since Youkai typically eat only humans to sate hunger, Yukari's statement isn't going to be simply: 'yeah they eat tofu humans'. It's true we don't have anything concrete, but younger youkai definitely aren't too coherent with rules and systems, the key example being medicine melancholy and Hieda's description of her being: 'Dangerous due to lack of knowledge and experience'
it is officially stated in [東方求聞史紀 ~ Perfect Memento in Strict Sense.] that
[殆どの外来人は、妖怪に捕まるとすぐ食べられるか、妖怪が飽きてしまうと食べられてしまう。] (Most outsiders that get caught by youkai either get eaten at once, or get eaten once the youkai lose interest in them.)
No. Touhouwiki aren't written by ZUN, guys. You shouldn't believe literally everything that's written on some wiki page. Try and do some research yourselves, it won't take much time.
And I'll just repeat my previous statement: All we have on this subject in canon is actually just a couple of vague/ambiguous pieces and nothing more.
And keywords here are: just_a_couple and vague/ambiguous.
When humans from the outer world wander into Gensokyo, it's all thanks to fluctuations in the boundary caused by Yukari. There is an enchanting element about the phenomenon which people like to call "Spirited Away"; if it is ever discovered that spiriting away is not the work of gods, but the meddling of a youkai girl, the term will lose all of its mystique. -- PCB, Yukari's profile
Just about the only thing in common between youkai is that they attack and prey upon humans. There are definitely exceptions, but many fall towards this trend. ... Humans have no greater enemy than youkai. Youkai attack humans for food. However, most do not attack when they are full and satisfied. If the human population drops, youkai will face trouble as well. They do not eat only humans, but animals, birds, fish, vegetables, fruits, alcohol and other things humans normally eat. Still, they consider humans a delicacy above all else. -- PMiSS, pages 31-32
The details of this contract are that the youkai will offer them humans from which to feed (*3); in return, the vampires will not attack humans living in Gensokyo. Of course, the contract remains in effect to this day. -- PMiSS, page 75
Most outsiders that get caught by youkai either get eaten at once, or get eaten once the youkai lose interest in them. -- PMiSS, page 110
Muenzuka is the graveyard for those without relatives and those who committed suicide in the outside world; many end up at this place after wandering aimlessly. ... Once again, this road is a place where encountering a human from the outside world is very likely. Because of this, there are also nasty youkai who lie in wait, hoping for a meal. -- PMiSS, page 148
Touhou canon is sketchy, full of holes, contradicts itself constantly, and is often told by an unreliable narrator. No amount of discussion will change that.
I like Zounose. It's not my usual cup of tea, but these darker stories are nice once in awhile. I like how he tells dark, heavy stories without going all stupidly grimdark, something that so many other artists and circles fail to do.
If you are hungry enough, you'll eat anything. And as a youkai, if we are to trust what is written in the doujin, only eating human flesh will really sate their hunger.
And the Sausages was made from a human.
Okay then, that makes more sense now. Thanks for clearing things up for me.
Now, ignoring the whole kappa factory thing, the story in this doujin is actually pretty close to actual Gensoukyo, I guess.
Sorry gentlemen, I discussed that subject on other resources far too many times. I'm just too tired of it to remember all counter-quotes, fragments and frames from touhou manga and books, discuss reliability of sources and quality of translations all over and over again. And Zaku Zelo said everything right.
If you personally like to think that most of frilly dressed little youkai girls in Touhou setting are actually a killers and a man-eaters, and Yukari is a cunning mass murderer on a daily basis - why the hell not?
Well, some people consider it to be funny, so why not? Anything goes if it's interesting.
Sorry gentlemen, I discussed that subject on other resources far too many times. I'm just too tired of it to remember all counter-quotes, fragments and frames from touhou manga and books, discuss reliability of sources and quality of translations all over and over again. And Zaku Zelo said everything right.
If you personally like to think that most of frilly dressed little youkai girls in Touhou setting are actually a killers and a man-eaters, and Yukari is a cunning mass murderer on a daily basis - why the hell not?
So what IS canon to you? If it's not word of the author, is it, one's own imagination? I don't mind people having their own views, but surely there is a set down canon, unless everything we read, play in this franchise is completely loopy and incorrect even in the eyes of the author.
Why even ask? We have Rinnosuke's books, we have several manga series, we have games.
What can we see in canon works? Little girls everywhere, frilly dresses, hats, danmaku games, slice-of-life narration style, tea party endings, festivals and booze, "nothing really happened in the end", etc etc etc.
What don't we see (and I'm pretty sure we'll never ever see in future canon works)? Any confirmed evidences (not even circumstantial/indirect ones i.e. confirmed by someone but not shown to us) of lethal violence, homicides, man-eating, any real cruelty, any Truly Evil plot-schemes, etc etc etc.
A sole fact that I can remember - is a small hand wound Marisa got from Kasen's tiger, when she tried to loot him for rare ingredients. It was actually quite funny how the situation evolved from "whoa, we have dangerous tigers here" to "what the hell Marisa, he was just trying to defend himself".
And so, we have some kind of "Russel's teapot" (or Invisible Pink Unicorn, if you like that concept better) here. "Yep, youkai girls are man-eaters and will kill other rational beings for food and lulz, yep, Yukari is feeding all of them with humans/blood, but no, we won't ever see any direct/indirect facts about it, so we don't have (and will never have) any solid proof, but this is still canon. Try to prove otherwise!" But nobody is capable of proving otherwise, of course, cause nobody is capable of proving the non-existence of anything.
What do we have on one hand? Basically a several weirdly-worded places in Akyuu books (I can't help but thing "so what?" and "what exactly does that mean?" about every such place), and a couple of pieces from all other sources combined (like that frame with Yukari-Kasen dialog in WaHH).
What do we have on the other? Well... Everything else? Nobody in any manga/story/game never thinks/talks/mentions/remembers/worries about something like that. Ever.
Whoa, that was one long commentary... I hope what I wrote is comprehendable.
So even if ZUN himself says something, you're gonna discredit that and the translation of 4-5 translators just because ZUN didn't specifically write about 1 murder or event of a Youkai eating a human?
This reminds me of all the Madoka Magica fans that refuse to believe the series is actually sad and descredit all the "Word of gods" stuff from interviews and data books as "The authors don't know what the hell they are talking about".
Tetsamaru said: This reminds me of all the Madoka Magica fans that refuse to believe the series is actually sad and descredit all the "Word of gods" stuff from interviews and data books as "The authors don't know what the hell they are talking about".
Wait a minute, some people think Madoka isn't sad? How is that possible? Granted, the first season had a rather optimistic ending, all things considered, but everything before then?
So even if ZUN himself says something, you're gonna discredit that and the translation of 4-5 translators...
Actually, I was talking about exact opposite. Even if ZUN will say "nah, people and youkai are living in complete peace nowadays" - and THAT is what characters in Touhou directly stated good dozen of times already, including Akyuu in PMiSS and narrator in ending comments - and that is what we basically saw in all books and manga - lots of people will still cling to exaggerated theories like "He wasn't actually talking about outsiders then! So they don't count". Like one we have here. But that's Zounose and his mind-blowing silly dark stories, they're fine with me. Like Asatsuki-dou stories, or like Jiroo ones. But calling them "basically what happening in canon"? That's just being silly.
But honestly, whatever. I don't like this discussion, it's useless and won't lead us anywhere. You are free to believe whatever "explicitly stated" canon you want to.
Wait a minute, some people think Madoka isn't sad? How is that possible? Granted, the first season had a rather optimistic ending, all things considered, but everything before then?
I've had people rage quit some chat rooms whenever I mention the fact that Sayaka dies and that Madoka essentially never get's to be with her family again. Some people just wanna believe want they wanna believe.
Akyuu is not to be trusted. Everything in PMISS is from her personal view and that of youkai trying to trump themselves up. She's as biased as Aya. That said in this day and age the point of her writing isn't to be as accurate as possible, anyway, but to serve as a lasting reminder of the danger of youkai. Take it with a grain of salt.
Profiles like Yukari's, on the other hand, is Word of God. Profiles and such are setting and is the closest thing to a source in Touhou.
The Humans of Gensokyo and youkai stage kidnapping games, for crying out loud. There are mock battles protected by the spellcard rules. It's all designed to sate all those involved and keep Gensokyo's delicate balance.
The consensus of everything canon or close to canon is, wild youkai eat stray humans from the outside, but is really no different from a lost human in the jungle being prey to wild animals. That's all it really is. And unless it's believed a village human came to harm, like what happened in WAHH when they nearly organized a hunting party to find the perpetrator, everything is gravy. As unfortunate as it may still seem, *at least* she's only spiriting away the lost, the destitute, the suicidal, etc. It's still dark, but is also such a minor part of Touhou that has no effect on anything.
In the end, it doesn't even matter, though. It's not there to make Gensokyo super serious, and the moe girls aren't there to make Gensokyo a super duper cute place with sunshine and rainbows. If anything the contradictions are really only to be taken as a sort of dark humor. But doujinka will do what they want to do.
No, ZUN had Akyuu say something, and she's said things that directly contradict known facts from canon material, like how she thinks Mokou was descended from youkai exterminator ninjas. Akyuu herself even says in the PMiSS Monologue: "a number of the youkai threat levels have been inflated somewhat in this volume" and "nowadays, youkai almost never eat humans." PMiSS articles being unreliable is canon.
The only canon you can truly rely on is that dialogue and events actually seen in the games (presumably only certain routes), comics (aside from the Inabas gag manga), books etc. happened exactly the way they're shown. Probably. Character profiles and in-game narration should also be considered accurate, although you could probably find some contradictions even in those. Anything else is hearsay and depends on how much you can trust the character who's saying it.
All that said, the impression given by all of the canon materials is overwhemingly that Gensokyo is peaceful, humans and youkai only play-fight now, and only the vampires still rely on humans for sustinence (and they get outsider suicides direct from Yukari, so no one is actually killed for it). This is the Gensokyo that ZUN shows us. It's not "dark things are hidden beneath the surface, there must be a side of Gensokyo we're not seeing," but rather "dark things are in the past, Gensokyo has become a nice place despite all that mythological baggage."
All this really means is you can't expect ZUN to ever write something like this fan comic. This isn't the Gensokyo he wants to portray.
No, ZUN had Akyuu say something, and she's said things that directly contradict known facts from canon material, like how she thinks Mokou was descended from youkai exterminator ninjas. Akyuu herself even says in the PMiSS Monologue: "a number of the youkai threat levels have been inflated somewhat in this volume" and "nowadays, youkai almost never eat humans." PMiSS articles being unreliable is canon.
Aaaaand here we go. Each time there's a discussion about Gensokyo, there's that one guy who says that sources aren't reliable because of some reason, thus making the whole discussion pointless. What's the point of arguing if the only reliable sources are 5-6 lines from a game quickly said before a fight, and if all books and informations about the lore are to be ignored because they are unreliable? I'll answer for you : there is none. Claiming that a manga or a book is silly and/or unreliable and therefore should be ignored basically means you get to choose your sources. And that's terrible, no matter the reason.
No, ZUN had Akyuu say something, and she's said things that directly contradict known facts from canon material, like how she thinks Mokou was descended from youkai exterminator ninjas. Akyuu herself even says in the PMiSS Monologue: "a number of the youkai threat levels have been inflated somewhat in this volume" and "nowadays, youkai almost never eat humans." PMiSS articles being unreliable is canon.
The only canon you can truly rely on is that dialogue and events actually seen in the games (presumably only certain routes), comics (aside from the Inabas gag manga), books etc. happened exactly the way they're shown. Probably. Character profiles and in-game narration should also be considered accurate, although you could probably find some contradictions even in those. Anything else is hearsay and depends on how much you can trust the character who's saying it.
All that said, the impression given by all of the canon materials is overwhemingly that Gensokyo is peaceful, humans and youkai only play-fight now, and only the vampires still rely on humans for sustinence (and they get outsider suicides direct from Yukari, so no one is actually killed for it). This is the Gensokyo that ZUN shows us. It's not "dark things are hidden beneath the surface, there must be a side of Gensokyo we're not seeing," but rather "dark things are in the past, Gensokyo has become a nice place despite all that mythological baggage."
All this really means is you can't expect ZUN to ever write something like this fan comic. This isn't the Gensokyo he wants to portray.
If you want ZUN's word on it then read the stories on the music CDs. Maribel gets attacked in The Bamboo Forest of the Lost (presumably) saved by Mokou (presumably) Dolls in Psuedo Paradise is shown in the outsiders' perspective.
Aaaaand here we go. Each time there's a discussion about Gensokyo, there's that one guy who says that sources aren't reliable because of some reason, thus making the whole discussion pointless. What's the point of arguing if the only reliable sources are 5-6 lines from a game quickly said before a fight, and if all books and informations about the lore are to be ignored because they are unreliable? I'll answer for you : there is none. Claiming that a manga or a book is silly and/or unreliable and therefore should be ignored basically means you get to choose your sources. And that's terrible, no matter the reason.
No to everything here and what you guys are saying.
Look at the source material. Go ahead. I'll wait. You see how NO ONE is ever being killed or eaten, EVER? Yeah. Empirical proof is best proof. Touhou is not grimdark and it never will be, no matter how much goofy fanfiction gets thrown around.
It's called joking around and hyperbole, people. Not everything said in the series is 100% literal.
Also the main danmaku games are the main focus and only source material of touhou, everything else is pretty much non-canon fanservice omake. Kind of like the filler arcs in anime adaptations of mangas.
No to everything here and what you guys are saying.
Look at the source material. Go ahead. I'll wait. You see how NO ONE is ever being killed or eaten, EVER? Yeah. Empirical proof is best proof. Touhou is not grimdark and it never will be, no matter how much goofy fanfiction gets thrown around.
It's called joking around and hyperbole, people. Not everything said in the series is 100% literal.
Also the main danmaku games are the main focus and only source material of touhou, everything else is pretty much non-canon fanservice omake. Kind of like the filler arcs in anime adaptations of mangas.
You're telling all the people that has refferenced direct source material to read it. If you actually know the lore then you would know that danmaku has been recently been implimented. Also your no death accusation is also false since when reading the story of Dolls in Psuedo Paradise the narrator dies several times thus implicating that the narrator is people from the outside. Maribel actually visits Gensoukyo and gets attacked and saved on more than one occasion. ZUN said himself that Kisume keeps severed heads in her bucket. Perfect Memento in Strict Sense and Symposium of Post Mysticism rate youkai by friendliness and danger levels towards humans. Each profile for every one of the characters show how dangerous they can be. If you want something explicitly stated then there is plenty of proof out there that is 100% serious. The joking around and hyperbole as you state is only in the stories told not the information given.
can´t we just read the story and stop fighting about this, we can´t understand the gensokyo of ZUN because we are not him, we don´t know what is thinking or what he truly feel about his creation, besides everyone has its own canon in her head based on what he/she know
can´t we just read the story and stop fighting about this, we can´t understand the gensokyo of ZUN because we are not him, we don´t know what is thinking or what he truly feel about his creation, besides everyone has its own canon in her head based on what he/she know
That doesn't mean discount what is referenced. That is what this fight is about.
can´t we just read the story and stop fighting about this, we can´t understand the gensokyo of ZUN because we are not him, we don´t know what is thinking or what he truly feel about his creation, besides everyone has its own canon in her head based on what he/she know
This almost sounds like your saying there is no canon because everyone has their own head canon. That describes literally every fictional work in existance. The arguement being made is that ZUN himself have given facts, either through books or interwviews and what's canon and what's fanon.
This almost sounds like your saying there is no canon because everyone has their own head canon. That describes literally every fictional work in existance. The arguement being made is that ZUN himself have given facts, either through books or interwviews and what's canon and what's fanon.
if we have facts, then why we always fight about the same?
No, ZUN had Akyuu say something, and she's said things that directly contradict known facts from canon material, like how she thinks Mokou was descended from youkai exterminator ninjas. Akyuu herself even says in the PMiSS Monologue: "a number of the youkai threat levels have been inflated somewhat in this volume" and "nowadays, youkai almost never eat humans." PMiSS articles being unreliable is canon.
The only canon you can truly rely on is that dialogue and events actually seen in the games (presumably only certain routes), comics (aside from the Inabas gag manga), books etc. happened exactly the way they're shown. Probably. Character profiles and in-game narration should also be considered accurate, although you could probably find some contradictions even in those. Anything else is hearsay and depends on how much you can trust the character who's saying it.
All that said, the impression given by all of the canon materials is overwhemingly that Gensokyo is peaceful, humans and youkai only play-fight now, and only the vampires still rely on humans for sustinence (and they get outsider suicides direct from Yukari, so no one is actually killed for it). This is the Gensokyo that ZUN shows us. It's not "dark things are hidden beneath the surface, there must be a side of Gensokyo we're not seeing," but rather "dark things are in the past, Gensokyo has become a nice place despite all that mythological baggage."
All this really means is you can't expect ZUN to ever write something like this fan comic. This isn't the Gensokyo he wants to portray.
Gensokyo is a nice place for people who live there. Not for dirty outsiders. In the same way that America is mostly a nice place for people who are citizens, not those dirty Mexicans across the border.
Lol people rely take TOUHOU seriosly ? touhou is a series of games, mangas etc that have young girls that fly and shoot "fireworks", fight a supposed villain and by the end they fiend out that the villain is not so bad at all, and she just wanted some fun bc she was bored and then they become bff like nothing happened and have tea and sake parties. Read the official mangas and see if they are dark and serious.This is the Gensokyo ZUN wants ZUN how's almost drunk all of the time, his work sometimes can not be trusted bc of contradictions ,retcons probably i am not too sure like Eirin being 100 mil years and most characters doesn't take themselves seriously. Even Akyu in PMISS said that the youkais made here portrait them more powerful,frightening etc and not all that is written there is to bee taken seriously it comes from her point of view. Is this the touhou fandom that GOD-mod the characters with the overblown attitude TOUHOU> all fiction ? Like rely on every touhou post there must be that attitude and ruin there personalities ? I like the fan made stuff that are like this more or less for what it is and such yes some seriousness is good but not over exaggerated.It seems that most of the fandom is made from those people. What i am trying to say is lets stop this is pointless sorry but i have to agree with Allaire,Zaku Zelo and nice starship btw Madoka had one sesson of 26 ep i think and beyond that are the movies with tow being a recap and the third the real continuation were Sayaka is alive i have my hick ups with that movie and the author milking the series and other stuff imo but that is just me way are we taking about Madoka Magica anyway ? this is touhou sorry for the long book people and sorry for my grammar or if i anger someone
Touhou is known for being vague, off the mark, and downright questionable. There is not even an explicit date since the calendar system used can date earlier than the oldest recorded date and in order to calculate the exact date then the cahnge in calendar systems must be accounted. There has been several implications of youkai interaction with the outside world and Yukari's word that she has been there. When you put it next to an anime which has all the holes filled or fixed so that the hole can't be noticed, you will see that Touhou is more like a spider web blowing in the wind. The foundation is there but the substance doesn't seem to be yet it holds it's own without any financial backing from 3rd parties. One reason that there are fanfiction is because of these holes. It's something to fill the gaps and provide a what if scenario. What makes any fanbase angry is when you blatantly disregard what is canon.
Yes but it seems that the fandome no disrespect, but ''is made of 12 years old people''. That like to overblown the story's and the characters and making them nothing like in canon and the attitude that touhou>all is that the fandome ? It seem that way and even if it was in an anime format it will still be like we all know bc this is how zun want it sorry but i can't take touhou seriously.I like it don't get me wrong for what it is i am not saying that there isn't any serious stuff in it, but not at the level that many people make it to be and claim and what calendar? what that has to do with touhou ? sorry if i insulted you in any shape or form.
Youkai are what people believe them to be. If most people believe youkai will eat them...they will. If most people believe they're harmless and moe...well, that's what they'll be. Belief is a powerful thing in Touhou canon, as has been stated several times across several sources.
What a shit show that was over an alternative interpretation of youkai life in Gensokyo. I can't believe people would draw the "not canon" card to discredit and criticize a doujin work. I can only imagine they do it because they have some moral agenda, because I don't see anyone complaining about the very not-reverent works of Imizu or such.
I like having a look into what it might be like to live as a youkai in such a world. You see something between the border of beasthood and personhood in how zounose depicts the Touhou characters; truly, mythical apparations and monstrosities such that some of these "little girls" represent were vicious and deadly creatures that would definitely eat humans or bring harm to them. I find this depiction believable. While still being whimsical and funny at times, the world he crafts has dimensions of a more gritty and serious nature. It also elicits a bit of moral thought, but, if the shitfest above is any indication, some people can't see with eyes that aren't of their own species. Whether it IS close to canon or not is nobody's business
Imagine being something that had to eat a sapient creature to remain sane. Imagine cows, chickens, or even plants that were in your food had names, emotions, and voices before being "harvested"... what if a youkai in Gensokyo lived a reality like that? That's what these fanworks explore. And it deserves to exist as much as the cute, funny, and pervy works of others.
every comment section from zounose's doujins it's an amazing shitshow
ScreeechThough manufactured, it's still human meat.Well, this is an efficient "system".It can sate the hunger of youkai.NomGet in a land and abide to its rules, they say...CrunchNomSo you're eating it too, Miss Mamizou.Even we cannot progress if we're hungry, after all.If you eat meat, you'll gain meat.
It truly is a simple and barbaric method...CrunchEspecially for these Tsukumogamis, it acts like magic.And so you brought it to this tsukumogami* meeting...
*Artifact spirit, the term that is generally understood to be applied to virtually any object, “that has reached their 100th birthday and thus become alive and self-aware,” though this definition is not without its controversy.MunchHeeey!Now then, about this ring...The expression of "Goddamn it's awful"!! But, a foreign object got mixed in, huh...
I'm losing my appetite even more...I see. It certainly is crying out.