I'm pretty sure she deflected one of their attacks back at them.. But as Deelles pointed out in the previous page, there are missing pages which shows the attack.
ILLUSION! Use dem light to create illusions, Sunny! Also, why aren't you guys invisible yet? Invisible/soundless = hax power.
*Before two missing pages are uploaded*
Oh man, there is just so much Sunny can do to mess these duo up. To elaborate on the illusion part, she could make themselves invisible, while making Yuuka look like Mima and Mima look like Yuuka, resulting in fighting amongst teammates. THis "might" be why Mima got whopped by "Fairy's" attack. Luna's ability of sound can make that illusion even more convincing, by altering their opponent's voice to sound like theirs... but I am getting ahead of myself. GO FAIRIES
In a way, it's kind of sad. More than looking forward to the continuation of this fight itself, we've been waiting to see Mima in action again and she doesn't even get the chance to speak. As much as I'd love to see Mima and Yuuka getting beat by fairies for laughs, I now want them to win just so Mima can have more speaking roles.
Oh boy, Gensokyo Tag Tournament returns! Now the question is, what kind of bullshit win will Hitomoji bring us next? Perhaps the fairies will indeed defeat Mima and Yuuka? Or maybe Reisen will stomp Yukari into oblivion! With Hitomoji, the only thing can be sure of is that he will make people job to Mokou to show just how much of a fanboy he is.
I'll still read it though, in the vain hope that Yuugi puts that bitch in her place.
Cosmic-Fusion said: Oh boy, Gensokyo Tag Tournament returns! Now the question is, what kind of bullshit win will Hitomoji bring us next? Perhaps the fairies will indeed defeat Mima and Yuuka? Or maybe Reisen will stomp Yukari into oblivion! With Hitomoji, the only thing can be sure of is that he will make people job to Mokou to show just how much of a fanboy he is.
I'll still read it though, in the vain hope that Yuugi puts that bitch in her place.
Kiku manages to make his wins into something reasonable as opposed to "Kaguya and Mokou somehow overpower someone which was shown earlier to toss Kaguya out of the ring with ease"
- has something planned for her opponents (which is improbable, since they don't think much ahead canonically, and she is usually the one who's left behind by her two friends when they run away :V) - doesn't know that Yuuka and Mima have battle experience before the spellcard system was established. In which case, I expect Luna to be MIMACHARGE'd too.. (something that would probably not work against Reimu, who has seen this move before :D)
Sunny would better try to make Yuuka and Mima look like Sunny/Luna and hope it works.. they (the fairies) must be able to form better strategies than their opponents if they're going to win. (see Meiling and Patchy's example, and Okuu's defeat because Ran couldn't play very well strategically, alone)
Cosmic-Fusion said: Oh boy, Gensokyo Tag Tournament returns! Now the question is, what kind of bullshit win will Hitomoji bring us next? Perhaps the fairies will indeed defeat Mima and Yuuka? Or maybe Reisen will stomp Yukari into oblivion! With Hitomoji, the only thing can be sure of is that he will make people job to Mokou to show just how much of a fanboy he is.
I'll still read it though, in the vain hope that Yuugi puts that bitch in her place.
*Sigh*
Refraining from using sarcasm is proving to be difficult, because you so proudly and openly advertise your ignorance regarding the basic definition of dankamu. That any outcome is possible, hmm? It's possible for Cirno, a mere fairy (however strong she is for one), to win against Yukari the gap youkai, one of the strongest entities in Gensokyo. There you go, a "bullshit win" brought to you by an official game and ZUN's very words.
Refraining from using sarcasm is proving to be difficult, because you so proudly and openly advertise your ignorance regarding the basic definition of dankamu. That any outcome is possible, hmm? It's possible for Cirno, a mere fairy (however strong she is for one), to win against Yukari the gap youkai, one of the strongest entities in Gensokyo. There you go, a "bullshit win" brought to you by an official game and ZUN's very words.
He was talking about Dei Shirou's comic. Where Kaguya and Moku, out of nowhere, pulled out Neisei Choujin moves, and then flagrantly ignored the barrier that arrested any power beyond physical limits to two man Kinikku buster Eiki Siki from the ROOF of the stadium. Which was after them using her Rod of Remorse, while in the barrier without feeling the several hundred tons of weight from their sins.
cd_young said: He was talking about Dei Shirou's comic. Where Kaguya and Moku, out of nowhere, pulled out Neisei Choujin moves, and then flagrantly ignored the barrier that arrested any power beyond physical limits to two man Kinikku buster Eiki Siki from the ROOF of the stadium. Which was after them using her Rod of Remorse, while in the barrier without feeling the several hundred tons of weight from their sins.
Is that so? Hmm. I thought, since he mentioned Mokou, he was complaining about the previous fight where Mokou won against Ran and Utsuho.
Nonetheless, "any outcome is possible in a danmaku match" is still the key point anyway.
You are correct, Lick king. He was complaining about this comic, given the matchups he mentioned...still, let us just get back to appreciating Yuuka's awesomeness.
Refraining from using sarcasm is proving to be difficult, because you so proudly and openly advertise your ignorance regarding the basic definition of dankamu. That any outcome is possible, hmm? It's possible for Cirno, a mere fairy (however strong she is for one), to win against Yukari the gap youkai, one of the strongest entities in Gensokyo. There you go, a "bullshit win" brought to you by an official game and ZUN's very words.
I was thinking about how to reply but then you just insulted me so I can see that anything I say in my defense will fall on deaf ears. Believe what you like and I'll do the same. I wouldn't think like this if ZUN actually showed that anyone can win instead of having the most powerful characters curb-stomp the weaklings even in danmaku.
StriderTuna said: Kiku manages to make his wins into something reasonable as opposed to "Kaguya and Mokou somehow overpower someone which was shown earlier to toss Kaguya out of the ring with ease"
What do you expect me to say to this? Do you want me to agree with you and drop the subject? I don't care if Dei Shirou did the same thing or he did it even worse. The only thing that means is that 2 artists don't know anything about power consistency as opposed to just 1.
I don't know what you're talking about when you say it's reasonable. Both cases are simply Mokou being far more powerful than she actually should be. It's a shame really. The idea of a 2v2 tournament is exciting but the execution just reeks of favoritism.
Cosmic-Fusion said: I was thinking about how to reply but then you just insulted me so I can see that anything I say in my defense will fall on deaf ears. Believe what you like and I'll do the same. I wouldn't think like this if ZUN actually showed that anyone can win instead of having the most powerful characters curb-stomp the weaklings even in danmaku.
I'm heavily offended by "believe what you like", but since I too unintentionally insulted you, I'll ask for your forgiveness.
I also assure you that my ears are far from deaf, unless your definition of deaf ears is 'anyone who disagrees for whatever reason'.
That said, although I did prepare some points I wanted to make regarding your comment, I changed my mind after browsing through some of your comments. I wanted to see what kind of axioms you work with, so that I could get a better understanding of you and make the discussion more fruitful. I decided you and I are utterly incompatible and, so, I'll back away before we offend each other further. Forgive my cowardice. I did learn some severe lessons a month ago which I don't want to repeat.
The Mokou vs Okuu fight wasn't too implusable as one could imagine Mokou having a 99-100% fire resist... and that's what Okuu was mainly using. As for getting knocked out? No one ever said Okuu was known for her toughness (unlike say the oni or Tenshi) On that note, Mokou would have a hard time against Yuugi as she'd be used to the heat enough to shrug off attacks that would drop most others. That and the whole "lighting an Oni on fire only makes things worse" thing.
Actually, danmaku does completely allow complete weaklings to beat overpowered enemies. It's perfectly evident in the games. Sure, anybody who knows what they're doing won't get their asses handed to them but I doubt many (or any) of us who've played EoSD can say they've NEVER gotten hit by Cirno in Normal or above.
Ability wise, everybody is completely unbalanced. In danmaku, it's a perfectly even playing field decided only on whether you dodge enemy patterns and can make patterns enemies aren't able to dodge. So in danmaku fights, you can't call a win to be bullshit unless the victory was decided by other non-danmaku related factors.
As far as Cosmic-Fusion's continuous ranting about Mokou, Mokou LOST the phoenix vs yatagarasu clash but she hit Utsuho on the back of the head. Like, really hard. With a spellcard. And Utsuho was surprisingly fragile for a last boss when I fought her so it hardly surprises me. Moreso since she was abandoning defense with that attack. Ran wasn't exactly bracing for impact either. And the whole immortal thing meaning Mokou and Kaguya have to actually give up to lose. That alone makes them both overpowered.
And as far as favoritism is concerned....you're name kinda implies something but I plan on disregarding it for arguments sake. The whole, arguments should be judged by the argument and not the arguer sort of thing you know.
StriderTuna said: The Mokou vs Okuu fight wasn't too implusable as one could imagine Mokou having a 99-100% fire resist... and that's what Okuu was mainly using. As for getting knocked out? No one ever said Okuu was known for her toughness (unlike say the oni or Tenshi) On that note, Mokou would have a hard time against Yuugi as she'd be used to the heat enough to shrug off attacks that would drop most others. That and the whole "lighting an Oni on fire only makes things worse" thing.
I am never buying Moku having any sort of resistance to fire. She's a human, a human that needs fire resisting charms in her hair and on her clothes to keep them from catching fire. Humans, last I read about us, cannot build a physical tolerances to fire damage outside of nerve damage that just removes the sensations.
So basically, by ensuring that their opponents can't use danmaku, the fairies totally screwed themselves here. Yuuka is after all one of the strongest youkai period. Mima's another top contender, iirc. The only chance they even had at winning was to use danmaku.
Edit: Also, how is the ZUN~ sfx possible when there's no sound?
Pretty much. She even stated how she was dying repeatedly the whole time after all.
But you make me think now. Has Mokou received nerve damage? And if she has, what other tolerances can that give her from a medical perspective? Does that mean she can't feel pinches or hugs or tickles anymore either? And does this mean she kills herself if she uses her flames too much and simply doesn't care to notice anymore?
I imagine rather that instead of having nerve damage, she just has an insanely high pain threshold-she does renegerate perfectly as far as we can tell. Imagine what life must have been like immediately after becomming immortal, but before devloping her fire powers...
cd_young said: I am never buying Moku having any sort of resistance to fire. She's a human, a human that needs fire resisting charms in her hair and on her clothes to keep them from catching fire. Humans, last I read about us, cannot build a physical tolerances to fire damage outside of nerve damage that just removes the sensations.
But her body isn't plastered with them and it took a particularly fierce attack to score clothing damage. As being an immortal being that specializes in fire use, I'm sure her skin is able to resist flames to a certain point or else she'd be burning off her hand each time she attacks.
StriderTuna said: But her body isn't plastered with them and it took a particularly fierce attack to score clothing damage. As being an immortal being that specializes in fire use, I'm sure her skin is able to resist flames to a certain point or else she'd be burning off her hand each time she attacks.
Actually, I prefer that interpretation because it makes things more dramatic and adds to Mokou's melancholy and pained character.
But since all this is fan interpretation and there are some evidences for both, we can't make definitive statements here.
All this discussion about Mokou, it makes me remember western moviegoers shouting bullshit while watching Hidden Dragon Crouching Tiger. The same audience who cheered on X-Men II, for instance. Eastern fantasy is pretty liberal with the kind of stuff "just training" let you do.
Being more specific, training and fighting their way to virtual godhood is a staple of shounen manga, and ZUN drops several references to Jojo's bizarre adventure, just letting us know he's familiar with the genre.
All the "Mokou is just a human" arguments are pretty much laughable under this light. She started as a human, but she has been fighting man and youkai for about 1300 years. (300 of which being pretty much nothing but fights). To call bullshit that she won against Okuu (a bottom feeder beast before gaining godlike powers a couple of years ago) is very strange.
The actual bullshit, for a story like this, would be Okuu, with virtually zero fighting experience (at least with her current form) having any kind of chance against Mokou.
- Okuu was hit from above (back of her head) AND from below (this is what I assume was her spellcard, and this is where the real damage would come from) - Mokou, who represents the mythological phoenixes, still get her hands burnt (and almost overpowered), and Koishi, as well, unexpectedly. Battle experience probably counted, in Mokou's favor, as seen in her ability to make decisions faster and react to Okuu's unexpectedly stronger charge.
_cf said: All this discussion about Mokou, it makes me remember western moviegoers shouting bullshit while watching Hidden Dragon Crouching Tiger. The same audience who cheered on X-Men II, for instance. Eastern fantasy is pretty liberal with the kind of stuff "just training" let you do.
Being more specific, training and fighting their way to virtual godhood is a staple of shounen manga, and ZUN drops several references to Jojo's bizarre adventure, just letting us know he's familiar with the genre.
All the "Mokou is just a human" arguments are pretty much laughable under this light. She started as a human, but she has been fighting man and youkai for about 1300 years. (300 of which being pretty much nothing but fights). To call bullshit that she won against Okuu (a bottom feeder beast before gaining godlike powers a couple of years ago) is very strange.
The actual bullshit, for a story like this, would be Okuu, with virtually zero fighting experience (at least with her current form) having any kind of chance against Mokou.
She may lack experience, but she makes up for it in sheer brute force and Brazenly surprising tactics. Moku never expected Okuu to Headbutt her while being aflame with radioactive fire. (which Killed Moku countless times, by her own admission, she lost count of the deaths that one move cost her.)
And on top of that, Moku's only been an immortal for one thousand years, and she's only relatively recently discovered her Fire magic. Before that she was losing consistently to Kaguya in their eternal grudge.
cd_young said: She may lack experience, but she makes up for it in sheer brute force and Brazenly surprising tactics. Moku never expected Okuu to Headbutt her while being aflame with radioactive fire. (which Killed Moku countless times, by her own admission, she lost count of the deaths that one move cost her.)
And on top of that, Moku's only been an immortal for one thousand years, and she's only relatively recently discovered her Fire magic. Before that she was losing consistently to Kaguya in their eternal grudge.
No, the head butt was part of the attack. Their clash was illustrated as fist to head so there was no surprise move there, just overpowering force.
I always wondered when Mokou got her fire power. Which official work was it stated in again? Inaba of the Earth and Inaba of the Moon?
cd_young said: And on top of that, Moku's only been an immortal for one thousand years, and she's only relatively recently discovered her Fire magic. Before that she was losing consistently to Kaguya in their eternal grudge.
Oh what? Her age? Kaguya beating her soundly with her 7 impossible treasures for several centuries? Or Moku not being a pyrokinetic right from the get go?
cd_young said: Oh what? Her age? Kaguya beating her soundly with her 7 impossible treasures for several centuries? Or Moku not being a pyrokinetic right from the get go?
Kaguya and Mokou killed each others, for the lulz; Mokou mentions that Kaguya knows that Mokou can't die, yet she sends assassins (possibly to annoy her, kill time, etc). Mokou may have met Maribel (Mary, Maribelle, or whatever her name is), during her time travel, and at that time -- if she was indeed Mokou -- she was already wielding flames.
cd_young said: Oh what? Her age? Kaguya beating her soundly with her 7 impossible treasures for several centuries? Or Moku not being a pyrokinetic right from the get go?
For Kaguya beating Mokou soundly for any length of time. We know Mokou wasn't pyrokinetic before drinking the hourai. Any source for she only gaining these recently, as opposed to, say, a few years after the elixir.
Because her backstory said so. Moku was LOSING the grudge to Kaguya because before she learned her fire magic, she was an immortal noble woman, WITH NO MAGICAL POWERS HOLDING AN IMMORTAL GRUDGE WITH A LUNARIAN WHO DOES. Sorry for the caps
cd_young said: Because her backstory said so. Moku was LOSING the grudge to Kaguya because before she learned her fire magic, she was an immortal noble woman, WITH NO MAGICAL POWERS HOLDING AN IMMORTAL GRUDGE WITH A LUNARIAN WHO DOES. Sorry for the caps
Yes, yes. Source for where her backstory says this? I've been again on touhouwiki.net and read what I could about Mokou, and could not find that she was losing consistently to Kaguya, at any point of their relationship.