Posted under General
Aliasing:
Reason: All costumes/outfits are clothes, but not every clothes is a costume.
Updated by a moderator
So you'd rather call post #752101 or post #765221 clothes than a costume? Seems backwards in some cases.
I think it's a pretty nebulous matter of semantics, though. 'costume' in this case only implies to me "This character usually wears the same thing all the time, thus why a change of clothing is notable."
Probably depends on the image. As a tag, nude refers to images in which (I guess the right word is) the torso or trunk of the body is bare. Cloaks, capes, and probably even jackets/coats (depending on how they're worn, like jacket_on_shoulders) would not count if worn and the body is exposed.
Are you thinking about images like post #375616 and post #65546 with bodypaint? They're still tagged with their various depicted clothing, despite being just painted on and qualifying for nude.
That's obvious since a swimsuit drawn on a canvas or one drawn on a body is still worth to be tagged. (a picture in a picture).
Are you insinuating that you would tag a nude character with a dress they don't usually wear painted onto them as alternate_costume even though they aren't wearing anything?
Renim, I'm not saying nude and clothing tags should be exclusive, obviously they could be present in the same image in various ways. Please just focus on the tag usage that indicates actual, real clothing the character is wearing.
7HS's second example doesn't fit, since if a character is nude, none of the tag I proposed will apply.
Back to the OP, I wish for the tags to come in line with other *_clothes. It sounds awkward to have a character wear Japanese clothes and it is being alternate_costume. Clothes is clearly what we refer to in general, whereas costume is a themed clothing. post #807859, post #685072 have different clothing than what they usually wear, but those are not costumes.
To me, it seems silly for post #685072 to have the tag in the first place, since it's hardly unprecedented for Ritsu to change her clothes - I think she hasn't a costume in the first place, so to speak, just her school uniform which is a consequence of the setting.
I suppose this is just my own opinion, though, and that for searching purposes people would want alternate/adapted_* to return any pictures in which a character wears something they haven't in canon.
I don't think I've ever suggested that nude and clothing are mutually exclusive, just stating the definition for the nude tag.
As far as usage goes, I don't care about a lack of uniformity, but I do believe that the usage of "clothes" leaves something lacking in the tag name. Frankly, I'd much more consider "alternate_costume" to "alternative_outfit" than to "alternative clothes."
As for adapted_costume, I believe it is frankly fine the way it currently is. As 7HS said, the costume her refers to their normal outfit. It is not uncommon to refer to the outfits a character is commonly in, to be referred to as a costume. I feel that calling it "adapted clothes" would lose this meaning, and thus why I disagree with the alias. Certainly if another character was dressed in the outfit of another character it would be called "cosplay" or "costume_switch."
S1eth said:
Are you insinuating that you would tag a nude character with a dress they don't usually wear painted onto them as alternate_costume even though they aren't wearing anything?
Is there a particularly reason that it suddenly doesn't warrant having a tag like or some other tag to point out that the character is depicted in a different outfit, when the outfit is merely paint? The character is still wearing it, even if it is paint. I don't particularly see any real logical reason to draw the line at where you're suggesting.
I don't understand. How is "_clothes" lacking than "_costume"?
And that's one more alias I'd want to reverse: costume_switch -> exchanging_clothes.
Because costume refers explicitly to an outfit that is commonly worn by the character. Here is one of the definitions of costume "an outfit worn to create the appearance characteristic of a particular period, person, place, or thing." Specifically in the case of "adapted costume" what is happening is that you're taking an outfit that is associated with the character (ie a costume) and altering its design but still retaining an association to the original. Changing it to clothes loses this meaning and makes the tag broader in appearance. For example, if a character is depicted with a dress made out of a swimsuit, and someone sees the name "adapted clothes" someone will go "aha! This kind of image should be under there" and thus miss the point all together of what the tag's intentions are.
As for alternative, I'm not going to continue arguing for it, but for adapted I will not budge.
The point with adapted_costume is the tag should only be applicable to a costume, which is my point.
You're not adapting the clothes, you're adapting the outfit, the character's costume into something else. Thus costume is much more appropriate than clothes. Clothes has no association with the character, costume does have this association.
Going with what you said, sure not all clothes are costumes, but only clothes that are costumes can be adapted in the context of adapted costume. Adapting clothes does not have the same meaning as adapting a costume or an outfit for that matter. A character has a particular outfit, a particular costume. You would not say that this character has a particular clothes to describe an outfit/costume associated with that character.
Updated by NWF Renim
7HS said: To me, it seems silly for post #685072 to have the tag in the first place, since it's hardly unprecedented for Ritsu to change her clothes - I think she hasn't a costume in the first place, so to speak, just her school uniform which is a consequence of the setting.
This is an important point. Your regular modern teenager in an anime does not necessarily have a specific outfit/costume/set of clothes unless the animators/character designers are feeling uncreative. If we're talking about for example K-ON! or any other KyoAni series, where there's usually a pretty stunning variety of casual clothes throughout the show. There is nothing "alternate" about Ritsu's outfit there at all because there's no static baseline to compare to.
I don't care if we use costume or clothes. I think that's worrying about the wrong thing. It's much more important for people to understand the "alternate" part.
