KC Nevada is probably one of my fav american shipgirls along with the Taffy III and the best representation of USS Nevada.
Always surprises me how AL missed something as ovbious as including her goat mascot but instead goes for the whole Las Vegas Stereotype despite Nevada not being from well The State of Nevada.
At least and surprisingly isnt as on the nose as Vicyory Belles' version despite them saying that they were going to do in depth research on each ship to create a more better historical representation of each shipgirl unless that only applies to writing.
KC Nevada is probably one of my fav american shipgirls along with the Taffy III and the best representation of USS Nevada.
Always surprises me how AL missed something as ovbious as including her goat mascot but instead goes for the whole Las Vegas Stereotype despite Nevada not being from well The State of Nevada.
At least and surprisingly isnt as on the nose as Vicyory Belles' version despite them saying that they were going to do in depth research on each ship to create a more better historical representation of each shipgirl unless that only applies to writing.
And weird thing about KC vs AL fanart count due to their different circumstances.
Kancolle is not as hot as it used to be in 2013-18s. But new girls still see slowly gaining fanart into a decent amount.
AL, the most popular (and nowaday, most sexy) girls will get crazy amount of fanart. Less popular girl barely get any...sometime by a crazy ratio.
Just look at Nevada_(kc) from 2023 gain more fanart than _(al) that debut in 2018.
I still find it funny, albeit sowhat sad, how people come into artwork for new Kancolle girls to actually diss on Azur Lane's designs.
Are the designs only good if you have a comparison do deride on?
They were merely commenting on the difference in design philosophy between the two, and how in their opinion Kancolle’s (accuracy of translation between ship to girl) is superior to Azure Lane’s (fanservice). Your strawman couldn’t be farther from the truth.
They were merely commenting on the difference in design philosophy between the two, and how in their opinion Kancolle’s (accuracy of translation between ship to girl) is superior to Azure Lane’s (fanservice). Your strawman couldn’t be farther from the truth.
But the designs are good, without the need to diss on another franchise to make the point, right? Or is the actual point to diss?
EDIT: Okay, sorry. This is all coming out wrong. AL has lots of fanservice designs, and there happens to be a problem when it's always the obvious fanservicey sexy new unit that gets all fanart while other characters are quickly forgotten. Which is part of another problem, the amount on units added to the game can be too much. Ranging from 4 in a "poor" event to a 6 on a "better off" event, there are way too many characters in AL to keep track of.
But what I mean is: I often see people coming out to comment how KC designs are superior to AL, even when AL was nowhere close enough to be called out, like here. I don't see the opposite happening often, with people in AL's official art posts deriding KC.
I often see people coming out to comment how KC designs are superior to AL, even when AL was nowhere close enough to be called out, like here. I don't see the opposite happening often, with people in AL's official art posts deriding KC.
No and yes.
Some of the KC designs were better than the AL, but some of the AL designs were better than KC. It just happen that AL leans a little too hard on the fanservice whereas KC starts backpaddling harder and harder that their "damaged CG" is barely even called so.
But the designs are good, without the need to diss on another franchise to make the point, right? Or is the actual point to diss?
The point of their discussion is to compare the design philosophies between the two and come to the conclusion of which one is better. Just as second place exists in a race, one being the lesser of the two is a necessity, and arguing that this is in bad faith is simply idiotic.
Sigfried666 said:
But what I mean is: I often see people coming out to comment how KC designs are superior to AL,
It may be a misnomer, but “The Complainer is always Wrong” does not apply to real life.
SigFried666 said:
even when AL was nowhere close enough to be called out, like here.
On the contrary, both Admiral Shippai and chongjunxiang brought up points to argue for the call-out. The AL devs did not include such a simple, yet striking and individual detail as Nevada’s goat mascot. Not only that, despite claiming to perform more in-depth research for greater historical accuracy, they couldn’t even be bothered to get the PLACE OF HER CONSTRUCTION right, a colossal oversight that, along with the lesser former, demonstrate how little research they put into Nevada before slapping on a generic and frankly overdone personality of “gambling showgirl” simply because a city famous for gambling shares her name. You, on the other hand, have provided no argument other than “they’re insulting Azur Lane!!”.
Sigfried666 said:
I don't see the opposite happening often, with people in AL's official art posts deriding KC.
Case in point, utterly irrelevant and bordering on an ad hominem fallacy.
But what I mean is: I often see people coming out to comment how KC designs are superior to AL, even when AL was nowhere close enough to be called out, like here.
I never said KC designs were superior, I just pointed out how much i love that artists in KC made a better representation than the current AL one, whetever this imply that AL is trash that depends on what you want from AL, most AL fans are completely happy with the type of design and nonhistorical direction Manjuu has taken for AL and the common argument is that AL is more flashier, sexier and over the top than KC, is that a bad thing? It is subject to the devs goals, Manjuu wants to expand its audience, C2 Staff wants to create an history buff mixmedia IP to share the history and stories of ww2 ships throught the image of shipgirls. Funny enought people also complain about KC becoming more tammed, personally Im ok with KC current direction, AL and the KC hentai doujins already fill that gap.
Comparisons are ok as long the context is made clear and the context was historical representation.
Sigfried666 said:
I don't see the opposite happening often, with people in AL's official art posts deriding KC.
Recent AL releases are paper ships and things not related to ww2 hence you dont see comparisons, and when it comes to actual ww2 shipgirls, we are talking about non UR small boats that dont spark any conversation.
But AL fandom comparing itself and trashing on KC still is a thing, funny enough shibafu, zeco and acea shipgirls tend to be targeted more often, now it is believed that this hate comes from ex KC players that are still upset at KC. The official azur lane discord server is infamous for spending as much time trashing on KC as they talk about their shipfus. And you can even check it out by typing kancolle/kc/kantai collection in the search bar.
LOTR3 said: You, on the other hand, have provided no argument other than “they’re insulting Azur Lane!!”.
That IS the entirety of my argument, yes. Your reading comprehension is top notch. As are your abilities in debating. Because, see, that is my ONLY point of small atrittion. The need to call out another title entirely.
Admiral_Shippai said:
most AL fans are completely happy with the type of design and nonhistorical direction Manjuu has taken for AL and the common argument is that AL is more flashier, sexier and over the top than KC, is that a bad thing?
I personally like not being narratively shackled to history, since the characters have potential to be much more. So I kinda like AL more for that.
Of course, that potential is squandered. No matter how cute, sexy, fluffy, outgoing, indoorsy the characters are, there seems to be little to no interest in ever "exploring" the characters after their initial release. With around 600 ships, there could be so many stories to tell, but...
Comparisons are ok as long the context is made clear and the context was historical representation.
Alright, point taken. AL was also the game that messed up the amount of turrets for one unit for the sake of simmetry, right? They corrected that, but since I am not a history buff, I found it all silly back then. But I can now understand how it would be annoying, even offensive, when the source material is not correctly used. By keeping a strict leash on the scenario, KC has more history accurate units, that also don't diverge too greatly in design, as is now happenning in AL.
Recent AL releases are paper ships and things not related to ww2 hence you dont see comparisons, and when it comes to actual ww2 shipgirls, we are talking about non UR small boats that dont spark any conversation.
It is very sad that only the strongest ships on every event are talked about. And receive fanart.
now it is believed that this hate comes from ex KC players that are still upset at KC.
Oh, I might be guilty of that. I'm bitter that KC never got a global release that would allow me to play fully. But then again, what made me quit KC was losing units. I don't like the sinking mechanics. (Sorry, Kuma, I was an incompetent Admiral)
Not the first time either in regards to KC. See the bit in Scamp over here.
God, that goalpost shift from claiming
"KanColle: *releases new character* KanColle fans: Azur Lane bad character design!"
to "people shouldn't mention AL designs when discussing KC character designs" when called out on fact that the commenters that mentioned AL in the first place play it, was just so disingenuous.
Like, there's literally no point in engaging since they even admit to doing it in bad faith.
That IS the entirety of my argument, yes. Your reading comprehension is top notch. As are your abilities in debating. Because, see, that is my ONLY point of small atrittion. The need to call out another title entirely.
That is the entire crux of their discussion, which one had the better design philosophy. Not doing so would be the same as not declaring who got second place for fear of upsetting someone. Not mentioning it leaves the whole thing empty of meaning.
SigFried666 said:
I personally like not being narratively shackled to history, since the characters have potential to be much more. So I kinda like AL more for that.
Then why base them on real life ships in the first place if it’s little more than a shoddy title? Besides that, AL claimed to do so but in fact did the opposite.
SigFried666 said:
Alright, point taken. AL was also the game that messed up the amount of turrets for one unit for the sake of simmetry, right? They corrected that, but since I am not a history buff, I found it all silly back then. But I can now understand how it would be annoying, even offensive, when the source material is not correctly used. By keeping a strict leash on the scenario, KC has more history accurate units, that also don't diverge too greatly in design, as is now happenning in AL.
Okay, so if you agree that mucking up simple historical details of ships is terrible, such as with the turrets, how come you have a different opinion on mucking up the place of construction and their personal mascot?
SigFried666 said:
It is very sad that only the strongest ships on every event are talked about. And receive fanart.
Indeed, sometimes a meta can take up too much of a game’s fanbase and it al descends into so much number crunching.
SigFried666 said:
Oh, I might be guilty of that. I'm bitter that KC never got a global release that would allow me to play fully. But then again, what made me quit KC was losing units. I don't like the sinking mechanics. (Sorry, Kuma, I was an incompetent Admiral)
Understandable, both untenable game mechanics and limited releases are reasonable dissuasions.
Poor Nev, not that she got back pain from her damage art, she also has to deal with another KC-AL debate.
But anyway just my perspective on this. AL and KC having both game themed after naval warships yet their respective design philosophies are really night-and-day and their targrt audiences are different.
KC has a conservative approach and is catering to those military otakus and history nerds, which is a very niche market and sometimes really hard to pleased since some of them are very meticulous even to the tiniest details that also explains KC produce less shipgirls as they put more on research rather than bringing out half-ass stories that would displeased their audience.
Meanwhile AL on the other hand is more liberating with their designs and wants to expand itself globally to a wider audience so they are more focus on the girls rather than the ships they try to represent, also weebs are more willing to throw money just to satisfy their fetishes. Like everyone said Kancolle is a game about ships as girls while Azur Lane is a game about girls as ships.
Being among the old ones here, mess like this is still nothing compares to the previous KC-Touhou fandom debate which in the end both sides just learned to coexists.
On a side note, I really like Nev is still being bitter towards the Nagumo Task Force.
Oh, I might be guilty of that. I'm bitter that KC never got a global release that would allow me to play fully.
Oh for fuck's sake, not this comment again! You really want to bait haters or you just want to suit the game to your needs.
Admiral_Shippai said:
But AL fandom comparing itself and trashing on KC still is a thing, funny enough shibafu, zeco and acea shipgirls tend to be targeted more often, now it is believed that this hate comes from ex KC players that are still upset at KC. The official azur lane discord server is infamous for spending as much time trashing on KC as they talk about their shipfus. And you can even check it out by typing kancolle/kc/kantai collection in the search bar.
Again, it has become their oath. To troll KC into oblivion.