So... many of these entries says that the man and the monster bang all day, non-stop.
When do they eat? How do they get groceries? Clean the house?
You know, when do they do all those small things that you just have to do to get by.
The answer to those sorts of questions is, as per how the author or his Japanese-speaking fans go, "Stop thinking about it or asking questions, the author doesn't mean what he's directly stating any time it would cause logical problems or be considered a bad thing."
Or in other words, "No matter how you look at it, it's you guys' fault the world-building is shit."
some clues that monstergirls not only have sex all day long found in the profiles. they work in jobs like humans, visit villages and towns as merchants to sell stuff, raising her children, go to hunt for food.
So... many of these entries says that the man and the monster bang all day, non-stop.
When do they eat? How do they get groceries? Clean the house?
You know, when do they do all those small things that you just have to do to get by.
The author said that the profiles are written in-universe from a subjective standpoint and not 100% accurate. Things like "sex all day every day" are just hyperboles.
The answer to those sorts of questions is, as per how the author or his Japanese-speaking fans go, "Stop thinking about it or asking questions, the author doesn't mean what he's directly stating any time it would cause logical problems or be considered a bad thing."
Or in other words, "No matter how you look at it, it's you guys' fault the world-building is shit."
Somehow I get the impression you were trying to be ridiculous but still ended up saying completely reasonable things that are absolutely correct. It is definitely the fault of people who take them too literally.
Somehow I get the impression you were trying to be ridiculous but still ended up saying completely reasonable things that are absolutely correct. It is definitely the fault of people who take them too literally.
Literally the only purpose of these is to perform world-building, describing these creatures and the world they inhabit, because they don't tell any story on their own. The fact that they then fail so miserably at this task that they have to blame others for their lack of world-building defeats all value of the whole series. I'm honestly amazed that this is still going on when I keep seeing this pop up in the comments every year or so...
Literally the only purpose of these is to perform world-building, describing these creatures and the world they inhabit, because they don't tell any story on their own. The fact that they then fail so miserably at this task that they have to blame others for their lack of world-building defeats all value of the whole series. I'm honestly amazed that this is still going on when I keep seeing this pop up in the comments every year or so...
Its more that his Japanese fans are expected to know the rules that his setting goes by and much of the lore. Its a cultural difference to some degree.
Further, many of the inconsistencies and other such problems are explained either in other material or via comments from Kenkou himself.
So... many of these entries says that the man and the monster bang all day, non-stop.
When do they eat? How do they get groceries? Clean the house?
You know, when do they do all those small things that you just have to do to get by.
In answer to your questions, note it doesn't say here they do nothing but have sex, only that the dark mage spends more time than usual in her home indulging in pleasure once she has a husband.
When do they eat? When they want to enjoy something other than each other's mana. If they have to, once a man becomes an incubus, he and his wife can live only on each other's energy.
How do they get groceries? It's pretty easy to grow food in mamono realms, and there are many markets in towns if you don't want to farm. Access to so much magic magic makes it even easier as the dark mage could set up a portal to get to a market quickly (assuming she can't just summon food with magic).
Clean the house? Ever see The Sword in the Stone? Magic would make that easy. As for monsters without a lot of magic, they would clean like normal whenever it became necessary, i.e. if the mess interfered with their daily life or upset their husband.
Its more that his Japanese fans are expected to know the rules that his setting goes by and much of the lore. Its a cultural difference to some degree.
Further, many of the inconsistencies and other such problems are explained either in other material or via comments from Kenkou himself.
The way I look at it, the descriptions on these entries are written "one-handed", as it were, not just in real life but in-universe as well. Which begs the question of why people in-universe let someone write this stuff when they're half-mad with lust...
...which, in turn, leads to my new headcanon that the entries are Demon Lord propaganda. "Resistance is futile, lie back and enjoy it."
The way I look at it, the descriptions on these entries are written "one-handed", as it were, not just in real life but in-universe as well. Which begs the question of why people in-universe let someone write this stuff when they're half-mad with lust...
...which, in turn, leads to my new headcanon that the entries are Demon Lord propaganda. "Resistance is futile, lie back and enjoy it."
The Western community floated that theory around before and Kenkou/the Japanese community tore it up for being too dark... which is ironic cause the books ARE written in-universe by self-confessed monster girl writers.
The Western community floated that theory around before and Kenkou/the Japanese community tore it up for being too dark... which is ironic cause the books ARE written in-universe by self-confessed monster girl writers.
"Written by monster girls" actually makes even more sense as an explanation. Instead of being consciously propaganda, it's wish-fulfillment fantasy by creatures with a high libido.
The point is that we're dealing with "unreliable narrators" here, where the purported authors are characters in their own right, with their own biases that have to be accounted for rather than taking the text at face value.
Its more that his Japanese fans are expected to know the rules that his setting goes by and much of the lore. Its a cultural difference to some degree.
Further, many of the inconsistencies and other such problems are explained either in other material or via comments from Kenkou himself.
It's exactly that "it's just that you're just not Japanese enough to understand how brilliantly thought out everything is" excuse that really stinks of raw hubris.
I've heard the explanations trotted out, and they're a Voodoo Shark - they just create even worse problems every time they try to solve anything. The discussions on the corrupted hero girls pages really expounded on this in extremely lengthy detail, so I don't want to rehash all that...
But still, in the first year or two of writing, monster girls were actually different from one another. Lamia were monster girls that lived in human communities and were generally just people with snake tails and a jealous streak, while matango were basically the equivalent of a zombie plague. Since going into the circumstances of the new Demon Lord, he's not only kept making every single monster girl a "will instantly fall in love with the first random man they find, which is by pure arbitrary author fiat ALWAYS their soul-mate no matter how gob-smackingly unlikely, and one or the other will be brainwashed into being a subservient sex toy because they 'secretly always wanted it, anyway'." (Because ACTUAL brainwashing is "dark and gloomy", we're going to just call it "what they always wanted anyway" even when they had no choice in the matter and their will is clearly being overwritten, even as expressly mentioned in the text from Kenkou, himself.) Plus, he's even going back and remaking all the older, actually interesting monster girls into more of the generic sameness.
But still, in the first year or two of writing, monster girls were actually different from one another. Lamia were monster girls that lived in human communities and were generally just people with snake tails and a jealous streak, while matango were basically the equivalent of a zombie plague. Since going into the circumstances of the new Demon Lord, he's not only kept making every single monster girl a "will instantly fall in love with the first random man they find, which is by pure arbitrary author fiat ALWAYS their soul-mate no matter how gob-smackingly unlikely, and one or the other will be brainwashed into being a subservient sex toy because they 'secretly always wanted it, anyway'." (Because ACTUAL brainwashing is "dark and gloomy", we're going to just call it "what they always wanted anyway" even when they had no choice in the matter and their will is clearly being overwritten, even as expressly mentioned in the text from Kenkou, himself.) Plus, he's even going back and remaking all the older, actually interesting monster girls into more of the generic sameness.
I don't understand how you can say some of those things, especially when a majority of profiles state a given monster girl will fall for a man who "strikes her fancy." Ones that go for the first random man they find are actually in the minority. The settings books even expand on the fact that most monster girls have preferences, an "ideal" man for them, its just that unless you're a scumbag there aren't really any kinds of men they hate.
And could you explain how any of the remakes have made a given monster girl more generic? Lamias for one are still pretty much what you said (well barring loners like basilisks and medusas).
Also, in-universe the profiles are written by a man known as the Wandering Scholar. He's described by KC as being somewhat unintentionally biased against monsters at times, and that despite his efforts for accuracy he often relies on short-term observations and interviews for his information before he moves on. Hence why his profiles are quite generalized and not the whole story. The only book authored by a monster that KC has made so far is the second world guide, written by the scholarly dark matter Saphirette, and it has a notably different feel from the profiles. KC has said that when it comes to describing the particulars of the daily lives of monsters her information is more accurate than the scholar's because she is one and lives with them all the time.
Lastly, I think most KC fans would admit the profiles aren't the most "brilliantly" written things around. He's an artist more than a writer. But many find them enjoyable anyway.
I don't understand how you can say some of those things, especially when a majority of profiles state a given monster girl will fall for a man who "strikes her fancy." Ones that go for the first random man they find are actually in the minority. The settings books even expand on the fact that most monster girls have preferences, an "ideal" man for them, its just that unless you're a scumbag there aren't really any kinds of men they hate.
And could you explain how any of the remakes have made a given monster girl more generic? Lamias for one are still pretty much what you said (well barring loners like basilisks and medusas).
Also, in-universe the profiles are written by a man known as the Wandering Scholar. He's described by KC as being somewhat unintentionally biased against monsters at times, and that despite his efforts for accuracy he often relies on short-term observations and interviews for his information before he moves on. Hence why his profiles are quite generalized and not the whole story. The only book authored by a monster that KC has made so far is the second world guide, written by the scholarly dark matter Saphirette, and it has a notably different feel from the profiles. KC has said that when it comes to describing the particulars of the daily lives of monsters her information is more accurate than the scholar's because she is one and lives with them all the time.
Lastly, I think most KC fans would admit the profiles aren't the most "brilliantly" written things around. He's an artist more than a writer. But many find them enjoyable anyway.
Hornet girl-"lets grab any man we find and offer him to the queen, we get the leftovers anyway" says you're wrong : post #241174
Original Lizardman says weak warriors' lives are at risk : post #241186 Remake Lizardman says even losers live, coincidentally just like every other monster girl : post #472136
The book with the short stories is written by human women-brainwashed-into-monster girls.
KC fans have basically homogenized into "shut up, enjoy the porn or get out". If its about the art, yeah, you're right fans love it. But if its about the writing; shut up or get out.
Hornet girl-"lets grab any man we find and offer him to the queen, we get the leftovers anyway" says you're wrong : post #241174
Did I ever say there weren't ones that were indiscriminate? I only said a majority only go after men who strike their fancy.
Original Lizardman says weak warriors' lives are at risk : post #241186 Remake Lizardman says even losers live, coincidentally just like every other monster girl : post #472136
That was more likely a bad translation than a retcon (same with lamias killing unfaithful men). Its also only a single example and a pretty minor thing at that. I don't see how it makes lizardmen generic when they retain their fairly unusual marriage requirements and literally everything else.
KC after all made the encyclopedia world with the express purpose of having a monster girl world where you weren't at risk of being killed by monsters (save for in self defense or defense of loved ones, in which case his monsters will still kill).
The book with the short stories is written by human women-brainwashed-into-monster girls.
Not sure which book you mean in particular, but the only canon ones are the two world guides and the two encyclopedia volumes, and of those the only one written by a monster is the second world guide. All the books besides those four are basically fan fiction which KC liked enough to make art for but for which he doesn't have any obligation to adhere to in his setting. Officially they are separate universes from his own which just happen to have similarities to his.
KC fans have basically homogenized into "shut up, enjoy the porn or get out". If its about the art, yeah, you're right fans love it. But if its about the writing; shut up or get out.
Not me, I'm happy to discuss the particulars of the setting, provided we can stay civil of course. Feel free to PM me on Monster Girls Redux, Monster Multiverse, etc., if you ever want to go more in depth.
The thing is, many of the most cruel aspects of Kenkou Cross's world are baked into the powers that he explicitly built up to ensure "happy endings" (which is nearly always defined as monogamous heterosexual lifelong partnerships that almost completely disregard the circumstances of meeting or the will of the participants).
Let's start off with homosexuality... It isn't allowed to exist in MGE. Gay men are transformed into women. (Presumably because they love the cock, so they must want to be women. Gay, transgender, what's the difference, am I right?) ALL gay men. Two gay men in an established loving relationship? Fuck 'em! (Literally.) They both turn into girls, and are forced to find straight men to which they are sex slaves.
Then there's lesbians. AT BEST, a lesbian will get one of the "very rare" Liliraune transformations, where they are "merely" brainwashed against their will into a bisexual, rooted to the ground, and have the extraordinarily rare ability to veto a man too abusive of themselves or their partner, but are nevertheless expected to make a good, proper, harem wife for some random man that comes along to claim them. (As someone posted on the liliraune image, it's a monstergirl where two women are making out inside a giant yuri flower, and they STILL become a cock-slave.) Much more likely, however, a lesbian is going to get transformed into a succubus, where her will, goals, desires, and romantic preferences are all overridden by cock, or she'll be subject to even worse transformations, like the roper for an eternity of tentacle sex.
The message is clear: Homosexuality simply is not valid.
It's not his fetish, so it's not allowed in Kenkou's world. And yes, it's not that he's explicitly going out of his way to persecute gay people, he probably thinks he's made some sort of concession just having a liliraune and allip, but that's the problem: He didn't think this shit through. He failed to world-build in, once again, a series of books explicitly about world-building.
Let's also not forget the way that Kenkou tried to Voodoo Shark his way out of having an overabundance of rapist-type monstergirls that might ruin all that monogamous waifu fun: Monstergirls imprint on their "husbands" a magical marker that basically declares both of them are "claimed" after having sex. This means that no matter what the circumstances (very frequently rape or mind-controlled luring into sex that's as good as rape), once you have sex with anyone, you are married to them for life. This essentially creates a first-come-first-serve basis for sexual relations. If a monstergirl rapes a man, she gets to keep him as her husband, and if a man rapes a monstergirl, she's his waifu, like it or not. Keep in mind, many monstergirls have explicit "become timid and docile to their husbands, especially if he beats them," in their description. The Kenkou universe is essentially written to justify and enforce the notion that "rape means love", because justifying having the ability to stay monogamous to your waifu in a world filled with rapist monsters was more important than ANYTHING else.
The issue of "rape victim = brainwashed sex slave for all eternity" is ESPECIALLY true of the Unicorn. The bicorn is a whole monster type that exists for creating forced harems against the wills and natures even of the sex-happy monstergirl types, and is explicitly caused by having sex with a unicorn after having sex with another monster... which is something unicorns are explicitly stated to never do willingly. Bicorns are basically created solely when a man decides he's not satisfied with the monstergirl he randomly got stuck with, and decides to rape another girl in order to force her into being a harem girl just for the purposes of forcing other girls into a harem against their wills, as well.
Frankly, the indiscriminate girls are pretty safe, the vile, abusive "husbands" they would choose to avoid because he doesn't "strike their fancy" will all be taken by the meeker girls that are easier to overpower and force into brainwashed slavery.
The various "fallen heroines" books (plus that succubus heroine thing he did before that) basically underline the outlook on how "brainwashing is good for you!" The heroines are people that have worked their whole lives to pursue goals of their own strength, independence, social status, or furthering ideals they believe in, but all those goals are totally invalid because they don't involve cock. The only way ANY woman can be happy is to throw everything they've ever worked for in their lives to have some arbitrary loser boyfriend... because they're "happier that way". Stepford Wives much? Any goal in life OTHER than sex is simply not valid.
Don't get me wrong, the men are all exactly as raped, brainwashed, and utterly stripped of all their individuality or motivations as the women, but Kenkou doesn't bother considering men as anything other than audience surrogates in the first place. (And why would anyone who still is a part of Kenkou's audience 5 years after he jumped the shark care about anything other than sex?)
That is to say, the "old gods" that we're supposed to believe are so evil have a point. For as flawed as their system was, it's better than the brainwashing rape cult where everyone will be happy just as soon as we give you your lobotomy.
And also, the notion that the narrator is biased against monster girls is more than a little ridiculous, considering how the narration talks about how great it is to do nothing but have sex all the time.
Let's start off with homosexuality... It isn't allowed to exist in MGE. Gay men are transformed into women. (Presumably because they love the cock, so they must want to be women. Gay, transgender, what's the difference, am I right?) ALL gay men. Two gay men in an established loving relationship? Fuck 'em! (Literally.) They both turn into girls, and are forced to find straight men to which they are sex slaves.
Then there's lesbians. AT BEST, a lesbian will get one of the "very rare" Liliraune transformations, where they are "merely" brainwashed against their will into a bisexual, rooted to the ground, and have the extraordinarily rare ability to veto a man too abusive of themselves or their partner, but are nevertheless expected to make a good, proper, harem wife for some random man that comes along to claim them. (As someone posted on the liliraune image, it's a monstergirl where two women are making out inside a giant yuri flower, and they STILL become a cock-slave.) Much more likely, however, a lesbian is going to get transformed into a succubus, where her will, goals, desires, and romantic preferences are all overridden by cock, or she'll be subject to even worse transformations, like the roper for an eternity of tentacle sex.
KC has stated in a Q and A that pure same sex relationships exist/are allowed in his setting. He's just not going to write about or depict them because they aren't to his tastes. Whether that is a good thing or not the MGE is a fetish setting, and appealing to that fetish comes first.
It's not his fetish, so it's not allowed in Kenkou's world. And yes, it's not that he's explicitly going out of his way to persecute gay people, he probably thinks he's made some sort of concession just having a liliraune and allip, but that's the problem: He didn't think this shit through. He failed to world-build in, once again, a series of books explicitly about world-building.
The priority of the books is to add to a world where one can have a monster girl wife and live happily ever after. They're about providing that more than about world building.
Monstergirls imprint on their "husbands" a magical marker that basically declares both of them are "claimed" after having sex. This means that no matter what the circumstances (very frequently rape or mind-controlled luring into sex that's as good as rape), once you have sex with anyone, you are married to them for life. This essentially creates a first-come-first-serve basis for sexual relations. If a monstergirl rapes a man, she gets to keep him as her husband, and if a man rapes a monstergirl, she's his waifu, like it or not. Keep in mind, many monstergirls have explicit "become timid and docile to their husbands, especially if he beats them," in their description. The Kenkou universe is essentially written to justify and enforce the notion that "rape means love", because justifying having the ability to stay monogamous to your waifu in a world filled with rapist monsters was more important than ANYTHING else.
Its a fair bit more complicated than that. A man is only "claimed" when he is strongly stained by the mana of a monster, and many monsters go through a lot of men before they find the one they want to keep as a husband.
And raping a monster girl does not equal her becoming the wife, especially if she is married or loves someone else. But given monster girls have an unconditional affection for men in general, assuming she doesn't already love someone else, and the man is not a irredeemable scum, then chances are they will just delight in him wanting to have sex with him. Its more rape play than anything else.
Lastly, KC himself has said that rape in his setting is not meant to be taken in a serious nuance. Its more built on ideas like "a hot, exotic woman pushes me down and has her way with me," kind of thing.
The issue of "rape victim = brainwashed sex slave for all eternity" is ESPECIALLY true of the Unicorn. The bicorn is a whole monster type that exists for creating forced harems against the wills and natures even of the sex-happy monstergirl types, and is explicitly caused by having sex with a unicorn after having sex with another monster... which is something unicorns are explicitly stated to never do willingly. Bicorns are basically created solely when a man decides he's not satisfied with the monstergirl he randomly got stuck with, and decides to rape another girl in order to force her into being a harem girl just for the purposes of forcing other girls into a harem against their wills, as well.
One of the fundamental rules of the setting is that a monster's husband (once he's an incubus) lusts only after his wife (though I suppose cheating could rarely happen before he becomes an incubus). Cheating thus only really happens in the rare cases where a monster falls in love with a married man without having sex with him, and in turn forces herself on him at some point.
When it comes to love monster girls adapt. They understand a monster can't just fall out of love, so even the most jealous or particular races will accept other wives. Its just that for unicorns this has a particular side effect.
And bicorns are more about attracting and persuading additions to harems than they are about forcing.
Frankly, the indiscriminate girls are pretty safe, the vile, abusive "husbands" they would choose to avoid because he doesn't "strike their fancy" will all be taken by the meeker girls that are easier to overpower and force into brainwashed slavery.
A man a monster regards as vile will never be loved by her, and given the nature of the setting will likely have something horrible happen to him before long.
As for enslaved, the only enslaved monsters that have been mentioned are ones that let themselves get captured, entice men they want to buy them, and in turn end up getting the man as a husband.
The various "fallen heroines" books (plus that succubus heroine thing he did before that) basically underline the outlook on how "brainwashing is good for you!" The heroines are people that have worked their whole lives to pursue goals of their own strength, independence, social status, or furthering ideals they believe in, but all those goals are totally invalid because they don't involve cock. The only way ANY woman can be happy is to throw everything they've ever worked for in their lives to have some arbitrary loser boyfriend... because they're "happier that way". Stepford Wives much? Any goal in life OTHER than sex is simply not valid.
The theme of the Fallen Maidens is that they were not happy as humans and Lescatie was not the great place it seemed to be. They all carried immense psychological baggage and are meant to be people who could never be happy without drastically changing. Their repression and psychological damage plus being transformed by monsters that are regarded as extremists even among monsters all caused them to become pretty extreme when monsterized. In summary they are not normal cases (and even then its not like all the Fallen Maidens ceased to work at or have goals other than sex, Merse for one continues to be a warrior teacher, just of monsters).
As stated below, World Guide 2 gives a clearer picture of what life as a monster is like and its honestly a lot more normal than one would expect.
And also, the notion that the narrator is biased against monster girls is more than a little ridiculous, considering how the narration talks about how great it is to do nothing but have sex all the time.
Instances where he is biased are likely few and far between. Its perhaps more accurate to say his information is inherently limited by the short duration of his observations and he is prone to hyperbole.
For a clearer view on what monster society is like you should really read World Guide 2.
I may not succeed in persuading you of anything regarding all this, but I do think its only fair to give the other side of these arguments.
KC has stated in a Q and A that pure same sex relationships exist/are allowed in his setting. He's just not going to write about or depict them because they aren't to his tastes. Whether that is a good thing or not the MGE is a fetish setting, and appealing to that fetish comes first.
Then why did he write out how they are explicitly removed from his world... because it isn't to his tastes?
Perentie said:
The priority of the books is to add to a world where one can have a monster girl wife and live happily ever after. They're about providing that more than about world building.
Ummm... What's the distinction, here?
Perentie said:
The priority of the books is to add to a world
Adding a world... as in, building a world... as in world-building. You can't even come up with a way of saying these descriptions of a world for the purpose of world-building aren't world-building without essentially even using the same phrase.
Or, in other words, your argument is, "It doesn't matter if the world-building is shitty because the purpose of the books isn't world-building, it's world-building!"
Perentie said:
Its a fair bit more complicated than that. A man is only "claimed" when he is strongly stained by the mana of a monster, and many monsters go through a lot of men before they find the one they want to keep as a husband.
Just more weasel words thrown in after the fact when people pointed out the logical conclusions of the world-building Kenkou had set up. That's not what's explicitly stated in a very large number of the monstergirl books. Rape = love = marriage.
Perentie said:
And raping a monster girl does not equal her becoming the wife, especially if she is married or loves someone else. But given monster girls have an unconditional affection for men in general, assuming she doesn't already love someone else, and the man is not a irredeemable scum, then chances are they will just delight in him wanting to have sex with him. Its more rape play than anything else.
Lastly, KC himself has said that rape in his setting is not meant to be taken in a serious nuance. Its more built on ideas like "a hot, exotic woman pushes me down and has her way with me," kind of thing.
Yes, and that's precisely the problem.
He wants a rape fantasy land, but then says "oh, it's OK, because everyone enjoys the rape due to all the brainwashing!"
The argument I've been making all along is that he wants to paint a Stepford Wives smiley face on the front of his nightmare world to try to keep people from realizing that just beneath the surface how every layer of rainbows and sugar coating he adds on to keep a light-hearted facade just makes the nightmare worse.
Perentie said:
One of the fundamental rules of the setting is that a monster's husband (once he's an incubus) lusts only after his wife (though I suppose cheating could rarely happen before he becomes an incubus). Cheating thus only really happens in the rare cases where a monster falls in love with a married man without having sex with him, and in turn forces herself on him at some point.
Because it's just fine when a woman rapes a man to force him to marry her even after he's in a relationship with someone he apparently loves instead of her! Don't worry, he'll still enjoy it after the brainwashing happens!
Perentie said:
When it comes to love monster girls adapt. They understand a monster can't just fall out of love, so even the most jealous or particular races will accept other wives. Its just that for unicorns this has a particular side effect.
And bicorns are more about attracting and persuading additions to harems than they are about forcing.
That's what Kenkou Cross wanted to think, but that's not the system he actually wrote.
For Kenkou Cross's world, everyone winds up in a "perfect" match thanks to either the iron-clad hand of destiny making sure that any random rape happens to match up soulmates, or he simply thinks that as long as the sex is good enough, the brainwashing will take care of the rest.
And again, Unicorns explicitly avoid non-virgins and will not go with them willingly. At best, you can infer cheating, but after a man has been married to a unicorn, he's "marked" (and the unicorn would absolutely, definitely want to mark him), so most other monstergirls don't want him willingly, either... No matter what, there's some sort of serious betrayal going on to make a bicorn.
Perentie said:
A man a monster regards as vile will never be loved by her, and given the nature of the setting will likely have something horrible happen to him before long.
Horrible things happen to everyone in this setting. That's kind of my point.
But as far as Kenkou's idea of "horrible" goes, no it won't, because he's explicitly taken all forms of horrible things off the table. "A great reward" is to have sex with a monstergirl. "A horrible punishment" is to have sex with a monstergirl. Basically, the only differences between monstergirls anymore is whether they're lolis or titty monsters, masochists or sadists, so "horrible" at most means he'll be brainwashed into enjoying being a masochist... but he'd still be brainwashed into enjoying it as much as a "natural" masochist would.
Perentie said:
As for enslaved, the only enslaved monsters that have been mentioned are ones that let themselves get captured, entice men they want to buy them, and in turn end up getting the man as a husband.
The argument I'm trying to get through to you is that Kenkou isn't a good enough writer to think these things through. He doesn't realize how many of his characters ARE enslaved, just like he's not a good enough writer to make a convincing alternate point of view for his narrator.
The difference is in whether you actually think critically about what he wrote, or just take whatever the narrator is feeding you without question. And considering Kenkou's most heavily relied-upon saving throw is to say that he has an unreliable narrator, that trope just begs its readers for critical thinking. The thing is, Kenkou fans just read what they want to read, and ignore all the implications because that will get in the way of reading what they want.
Perentie said:
The theme of the Fallen Maidens is that they were not happy as humans
Yes.
None of them were happy. NOBODY was happy because Kenkou only believes happiness exists while having sex. He denies the very possibility of there being value in anything other than monogamous heterosexual relations. People exist solely as fucking machines.
Perentie said:
They all carried immense psychological baggage and are meant to be people who could never be happy without drastically changing.
And clearly, the only way to help someone who's unhappy is through brainwashing them into being a sex slave! There's absolutely NO alternative to that, is there? Those guys the girls love so much couldn't just tell one of them that maybe they're working a little too hard, and need a vacation or something.
No, the thing is, these are not written as actualized characters with real dilemmas first, they are written as justifications for brainwashing first, and then Kenkou has to try to scramble to backfill some sort of disease terrible enough that he can convince some people his "cure" isn't worse than the disease.
And it's clear he's struggling more and more to do so, since his succubus heroine girls were not really that unhappy, and started out in a typical harem anime plot, but went straight for the succubus thing, anyway. When people complained, it suddenly needed to be a much more crapsack world to justify his "cure"... and even then, it's still not something that can't be cured with less drastic measures than outright OVERWRITING the personality/soul of the victim in the first place.
But what's more, it enforces that same pattern. When everyone is miserable unless "liberated" through indoctrination into the cult of sex-slavery, it says that any sort of life outside the cult is not worth living for anyone, not just cult members.
Perentie said:
Instances where he is biased are likely few and far between. Its perhaps more accurate to say his information is inherently limited by the short duration of his observations and he is prone to hyperbole.
No, it's limited by Kenkou Cross being a shitty writer that can't make an alternate point of view that is in any way convincingly different from his own. The whole notion of adding in a different point of view was only even invented as a saving throw against his own critical logic failures, and he hasn't even been able to follow through on the idea after creating it.
Perentie said:
I may not succeed in persuading you of anything regarding all this, but I do think its only fair to give the other side of these arguments.
I've heard the other arguments, and as I keep saying, they're a Voodoo Shark - they only make things worse.
it can be end in a different way when humans say this to monstergirls and mean it serious. come with me and be my wife or stay here and be my wife. (from free man.) from now on you life with us together or you will be a part of our family. (couples and familys.) i want that you become my mother. (from children without mother.) should bring monsters into inner conflict and with luck it goes to a good end.