Bardiche and Raising_heart

Bardiche and Raising_heart are devices/weapons of Fate and Nanoha, shouldn't they be general tags instead of characters?

No, they're characters.

Alright, so those devices can speak in the anime, but in pictures what makes them different from Remilia's spear_the_gungnir or Tenshi's sword_of_hisou?

I don't see a particular reason to make it a general tag, given that they are sentient and do talk. It isn't rare to see text bubbles coming from them, so their talking isn't limited to the anime (ex: post #808853).

rantuyetmai said:
Alright, so those devices can speak in the anime, but in pictures what makes them different from Remilia's spear_the_gungnir or Tenshi's sword_of_hisou?

...the fact that they are characters?

I don't see why this is complicated.

I'm just asking.

Character count is an important function to find pictures and I can't stress this enough. Looking for takamachi_nanoha fate_testarossa chartags:2 will miss out stuff like post #737699.

Maybe adding 2girls tag in the search will be fine, but it's a fact that not everyone tag solo, 2girls, 3girls in their uploads because it's not instinctive. It's also not possible if the other characters are males. Character's names, however, are 99% sure to be present and thus far more reliable to count.

People don't tag bardiche and raising_heart consistently either, because, well, they are items.

I think the point is two separate them into general tags when depicted as a weapon and character tags in other situations.

I don't know enough about Nanoha, but what exactly is an "intelligent device" in terms of how much of a character it is?

That said I've seen them talk even when in weapon mode so -1 from me.

Don't misunderstand me. Both devices are very much characters to me, I watched the show, love it and everything.

But the point of tagging and separate types are to use them to find pictures. Usefulness should be put on top of everything. They can talk in the show, but that doesn't justify their appearance in pictures, i.e. they are weapons just like all other weapons.

Btw, objects that speak are plenty on Danbooru, I even see several talking penis.

That said, depend on how everyone see fit. I don't want to go up against hardcore fan.

Mechas are commonly given character tags even when they don't speak so there's kind of a precedent. Maybe we need to figure out a list of requirements for something getting chartagged. Kind of like we did with copyright tags in forum #19664.

Anelaid said:
I don't know enough about Nanoha, but what exactly is an "intelligent device" in terms of how much of a character it is?

They're intelligent enough to act on their own volition on more than one occasion.

I don't believe they are just weapons. They're A.Is, seemingly with their own thoughts and free will.

Well I'm can't be too sure since I didn't really get to into Nanoha however during in the series there were quite a few scenes where I saw them being treated as they were actually living beings...well maybe not living beings but as characters(If you count being ask if they are okay after massize damage or is put in a conversation with the main characters unlike how other normal characters don't talk to their weapons after a fierce battle.

Also the two does acts without commends from time to time. Like during that time when Nanoha first fought Fate,etc. Raising Heart acts on its own to protect her and help her fight. Of course it could be argued that it was Nanoha's "whim" and/or it was auto-defence but that still does count as acting on their own...right?

The Evas also have a similar case and they are labeled as characters.

^_^;

I said I know what they are, I don't argue that.

What I'm trying to get at is when you look at this and this, what's the difference?

jjj14 said:
Maybe we need to figure out a list of requirements for something getting chartagged.

I'd really appreciate a discussion about that.

I guess it depends on the original story then?

If gungnir was able to talk, act, and was a mechanical weapons(optional here) that would have probably been a different case .

But come to think of it, why isn't Myon's tag a character tag? It is part of Youmu so technically it should be consider the same as her. It may not talk but it does seem to move on its own in a way and everything. Its not a weapon but more of a living...errr...half-dead/living ghost thing.

If Myon was a case where its suppose to be a general tag, why is Pyonta and mimi-chan a character tag then? Man this is all so confusing.

Visually they're likely to not be distinguishable from a named non-character weapon, but I do not think that is enough to say they don't qualify for a character tag. The information required to say they're a character would be no different from the information necessary for someone to tell the difference between a no-named background character (or made up character) and a main character.

In short the information to make them a character tag is not based on something visual, and is no different from the information necessary to know the characters in post #82418 aren't main characters from the Aria series.

Keo said:
I guess it depends on the original story then?

If gungnir was able to talk, act, and was a mechanical weapons(optional here) that would have probably been a different case .

But come to think of it, why isn't Myon's tag a character tag? It is part of Youmu so technically it should be consider the same as her. It may not talk but it does seem to move on its own in a way and everything. Its not a weapon but more of a living...errr...half-dead/living ghost thing.

If Myon was a case where its suppose to be a general tag, why is Pyonta and mimi-chan a character tag then? Man this is all so confusing.

Myon case was discussed in forum #54143, and in the end everyone agree to turn it in general rather than tagging only "interesting" Myon.

Pyonta is tagged when the hat behaves like a character so it remains a character-type.

Never thought about mima-chan.

Keo said:
I guess it depends on the original story then?

Okay, I guess there's nothing else could be done about it. Although the fact that 100% posts with Fate, for example, will get tagged fate_testarossa, while you'll spot a number of bardiche in fate_testarossa -bardiche search should say something.

Tag types are, to me, to help searching for something easily, not for fans to satisfy with seeing their stuffs being green. If the latter was the purpose, I'd say just discard character types completely.

But I'll go with the majority and forget the issue.

rantuyetmai said:
Okay, I guess there's nothing else could be done about it. Although the fact that 100% posts with Fate, for example, will get tagged fate_testarossa, while you'll spot a number of bardiche in fate_testarossa -bardiche search should say something.

Well if you look at it some tags do just stick like glue another. I guess its never a bad thing to start up a disscussion on something that is just extremely confusing.

rantuyetmai said:
Tag types are, to me, to help searching for something easily, not for fans to satisfy with seeing their stuffs being green. If the latter was the purpose, I'd say just discard character types completely.

I don't think it matters to much if you're just trying to search for a tag. The tag being a character or general doesn't really hinder the search as much except for maybe the color and confusions.

However I'm not really too sure if that is true or not as i never really think to much about what they are. As long as they can direct you to what you need that all it really matters then.

Keo said:
I don't think it matters to much if you're just trying to search for a tag. The tag being a character or general doesn't really hinder the search as much except for maybe the color and confusions.

It's fine that there are technicalities you don't know, but I wish you had actually read my posts above.

rantuyetmai said:
Character count is an important function to find pictures and I can't stress this enough. Looking for takamachi_nanoha fate_testarossa chartags:2 will miss out stuff like post #737699.

Maybe adding 2girls tag in the search will be fine, but it's a fact that not everyone tag solo, 2girls, 3girls in their uploads because it's not instinctive. It's also not possible if the other characters are males. Character's names, however, are 99% sure to be present and thus far more reliable to count.

People don't tag bardiche and raising_heart consistently either, because, well, they are items.

rantuyetmai said:
It's fine that there are technicalities you don't know, but I wish you had actually read my posts above.

Ah, truely sorry. Forgive me for my previous post then.

You can stress the importance of chartag searches as much as you'd like, but you'll have to forgiven me in seeing the chartag search as one of the most useless functionalities around (in its current form), and honestly think things would be better off if it was completely removed (so long as it remains the way it is).

So long as we have characters with multiple identities, important mecha, object characters, characters with more than one name, characters who are depicted at various ages, and imo even modified versions of characters, the chartag search will never properly work the way you want it to work without generalizing (and therefore sacrificing) all those types of tags. Frankly I think such tags are much better off as character tags (or preferably fit under some sort of subtype character tag) than being generalized just to make that search function "work." If it works by gutting out all those other things, then it frankly isn't really working. They're all related to characters, they're all specific identifiable character-like things in some form or another, or a type of character. It's not them being character tags screwing up the chartag search, it's the existence of the chartag search screwing up those tags from being character tags.